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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPC 03-24-2026 Youtube and Zoom TranscriptWEBVTT 1 00:01:16.880 --> 00:01:22.860 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I think we do not. So we will move on to oral communications. City Clerk, how many public comments do we have? 2 00:01:25.140 --> 00:01:31.599 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): We have one speaker in person, and no hands raised on Zoom. Our first speaker is Jennifer Griffin. Welcome, Jennifer. 3 00:01:41.260 --> 00:01:43.610 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Good evening, Planning Commission. 4 00:01:43.630 --> 00:02:02.610 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Good to see you all. I just wanted to bring up an item that I had brought up at the last City Council meeting. I don't really know who would address this, but it affects the safety of all of us. I have to drive to Santa Cruz two days a week to help my elderly mother. Don't tell her I said that. 5 00:02:02.700 --> 00:02:15.820 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): And she lives in Aptos. And that involves me driving over Highway 17. And you know what an adventure 17 is. But I will tell you that in the last… 6 00:02:16.000 --> 00:02:20.949 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): probably 4 months. There's a tremendous safety factor that is evolving. 7 00:02:20.990 --> 00:02:39.350 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): This is, north out of Scotts Valley, right before the summit. There is a new, overcrossing for, mountain lions and other animals, which is great, because it gets them off the roadway. But we have a problem with the safety of the median. 8 00:02:39.780 --> 00:02:42.970 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): There have been 4 to 5 deaths. 9 00:02:43.220 --> 00:02:58.919 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): at that area, just out of Scotts Valley, in the last, probably since January, December. What is happening is that people going north or bound… north or southbound hit the median. 10 00:02:59.170 --> 00:03:06.880 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Okay, that's fine. It keeps them from going into oncoming traffic, which was an automatic fatality years ago. 11 00:03:07.070 --> 00:03:10.459 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): But they are ricocheting off the median. 12 00:03:10.730 --> 00:03:27.579 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): shooting across the two lanes of road, and either hitting a tree, going down the hill, or coming back and hitting the median, and the whole vehicle goes over the median and lands into oncoming traffic. My husband and I were stuck there about… 13 00:03:27.710 --> 00:03:46.480 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): probably in January, where there was for an hour, and we knew on the radio that there was a motor… there was a motorcycle fatality one mile south of us. You can imagine, at that location. And you can imagine the despair by the time we got up there. 14 00:03:46.620 --> 00:04:01.039 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): And then, just recently, when I… every time I go over, there has been a fatality there. I don't know exactly what has happened. They probably need to have a two-story median at the location. 15 00:04:01.150 --> 00:04:08.910 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I've been going over there since I was a toddler. My grandparents lived in Scotts Valley. My, 16 00:04:09.390 --> 00:04:18.669 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): cousins, aunt, etc. lived over there, so I've been on that road for my whole life. But there's something strange going on. Now, about 17 00:04:18.940 --> 00:04:26.600 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Four years ago, we were told that there was supposed to be an overpass put in right outside, north of Scotts Valley. 18 00:04:26.780 --> 00:04:32.010 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Why has that not materialized? We have funding for 19 00:04:32.010 --> 00:04:47.459 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Animals Crossing in Los Gatos and up at the Summit, but we have no safety. We need to bring that in. I don't know who's responsible, but let's do it. Thank you. Thank you, Jennifer. We have no speakers in person and no hands raised on Zoom, Chair. 20 00:04:48.420 --> 00:05:04.469 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you very much. So, we will move on to the next portion of the meeting for public hearings, and the agenda item is to consider a use permit, tentative map, architectural and site approval, and tree removal permit for a 122-unit residential development at the Stevens Creek Office Center. 21 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:08.860 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Public hearing is now open. Do we have a staff report? 22 00:05:09.390 --> 00:05:14.409 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yes, thank you, Chair, and good evening, members of the… Point of order, Chair, should we do exported disclosures? 23 00:05:14.830 --> 00:05:19.340 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yes, absolutely. Apologies, let us do ex parte disclosures. 24 00:05:19.650 --> 00:05:21.270 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Commissioner Fung, would you like to start? 25 00:05:23.470 --> 00:05:29.329 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yes, in the recent days, I haven't met with the development team, but I did meet with them some months ago. 26 00:05:29.480 --> 00:05:33.180 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Had a, overview of the site. That actually must have been… 27 00:05:33.330 --> 00:05:35.110 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): 5 or 6 months ago, I think. 28 00:05:37.940 --> 00:05:43.950 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I have met with the applicant and had a call with them as well, and I also. 29 00:05:43.950 --> 00:05:45.479 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Heard from the… 30 00:05:45.830 --> 00:05:53.809 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The party that wrote in, which is the retail, neighbor of the applicant, I have not spoken to any, residents around the area. 31 00:05:55.290 --> 00:05:57.940 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I have met with a developer a few times as well. 32 00:06:00.790 --> 00:06:05.269 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I met with them many months ago, like Commissioner Fung, but not recently. 33 00:06:06.830 --> 00:06:09.899 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Same here, I met with them a few months ago, not recently. 34 00:06:11.440 --> 00:06:12.400 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you. 35 00:06:13.530 --> 00:06:19.660 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, thank you and good evening. Just wanted to do a brief introduction. I believe several of you had a chance to meet Shelby. 36 00:06:19.660 --> 00:06:28.210 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Maples will be the project planner on this. She's a senior planner, started with the city in December, so this is her first time here at the Planning Commission tonight. 37 00:06:28.340 --> 00:06:36.570 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): She will be leading the presentation this evening, and then I believe after that, the applicant has a presentation as well focused on their project, so… 38 00:06:36.670 --> 00:06:39.020 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): With that, I will turn things over to Shelby. 39 00:06:39.545 --> 00:06:45.165 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. Good evening, Chair and Planning Commission. My name is Shelby Maples, Planning Staff, and I have a presentation. 40 00:06:45.170 --> 00:06:47.570 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): For you on a housing development project. 41 00:06:48.980 --> 00:06:58.030 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The project is located on 4 parcels along Stevens Creek, west of Sage Way. It's in the heart of the city's specific plan Crossroads sub-area. 42 00:06:58.110 --> 00:07:09.049 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): To the east of the site is a Sageway station retail and Target, as well as a daycare. There's a Whole Foods and Abundant Life Church to the west, and then Residential Uses and the YMCA to the north. 43 00:07:09.270 --> 00:07:23.559 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The zoning designation of the site at the time of the preliminary application was Plan Development Commercial and Residential, or PCG Res, which is applicable to the proposed project, and it has a maximum density of 25 dwelling units to the acre. 44 00:07:23.720 --> 00:07:42.810 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The project proposes a housing development with 66 for-sale single-family homes, 56 for-sale townhomes for a total of 122 units, as well as the removal of 249 trees. The project entitlements include a use permit, architectural site approval, tentative map, and tree removal entitlements. 45 00:07:45.100 --> 00:07:53.220 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): For a little bit of background on the project, the site is currently occupied by the Stevens Creek Office Center, as well as Voyager Coffee and Panera. 46 00:07:53.480 --> 00:08:13.419 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): As far as applications, the SB330 preliminary application was submitted on April 1st of 2024, with the formal application following in September. From some additional context, the housing element was adopted in May of 2024, where one of the project parcels was identified as priority housing site number 9. 47 00:08:13.420 --> 00:08:25.700 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The SB330 application was submitted prior to housing element adoption in May of 2024, which locked in the existing PCG Res zoning and the lower densities that are proposed by the project. 48 00:08:27.540 --> 00:08:45.160 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): As we've seen with some other applications brought before the city, there are several state laws which are applicable to the project, starting with the Housing Accountability Act, which does prohibit cities from disproving or adding conditions that would render a project infeasible or reduce density, except in specific circumstances. 49 00:08:45.170 --> 00:08:56.390 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Then there's SB330, or the Housing Crisis Act, which streamlines permit processing and locks in the fees and development standards that were in effect at the time of that preliminary application. 50 00:08:56.770 --> 00:09:13.790 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Then there's density bonus law, which does allow the project to have additional units, though that's not utilized in this case. But it also entitles them to waivers and concessions based on the amount and type of affordable development provided. The project requests 12 waivers and 1 concession to support the project as proposed. 51 00:09:14.150 --> 00:09:33.800 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Then finally, there is no net loss. The city is required to maintain an inventory of sites, by income category consistent with RHNA. This site will not provide the number of units anticipated in the housing element, but since the project came in before the housing element, it meets the, vested designation. 52 00:09:36.130 --> 00:09:48.340 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Here's an overview of the project development standards. In the next several slides, we'll go over, the development standards for which the project requests waivers, primarily to Heart of the City setbacks. 53 00:09:50.900 --> 00:10:00.760 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So, as I mentioned, 122 units in total, with 66 single-family homes, 56 townhomes, including all 24 proposed below- market rate units. 54 00:10:00.980 --> 00:10:13.329 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The buildings are 3 stories, so 33 units do have access to rooftop decks, and the units range in size from 2,272 square feet to 3,773 square feet. 55 00:10:13.740 --> 00:10:17.500 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The project requires a use permit due to the vestate zoning. 56 00:10:18.140 --> 00:10:29.399 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Additionally, with the tree removal permit, a total of 249 trees will be removed, with 151 planned to be replaced on site, as with the remainder being compensated by an in-loop fee. 57 00:10:29.890 --> 00:10:34.549 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): And there is also a vesting tentative map for condominium purposes associated with the development. 58 00:10:36.500 --> 00:10:53.749 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So here's the site plan, showing the layout of the project. As you can see, there are the townhome buildings, shown here in the orange, green, and yellow, that are oriented towards Stevens Creek, with the single-family homes started towards the center of the site, and back towards Alves. 59 00:10:53.750 --> 00:11:08.460 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The BMR units are highlighted here with the red dots. They're all located in the townhome portion of the project. The units include garages. There are a total of 272 parking spaces throughout the project, including 28 guest parking spaces. 60 00:11:08.540 --> 00:11:15.350 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Each unit includes private open space, and also there's a common open space green, which includes the public art. 61 00:11:16.890 --> 00:11:20.420 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So here is a rendering of the project from Stevens Creek. 62 00:11:23.560 --> 00:11:42.220 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The project is largely consistent with the applicable objective standards, though, as we've discussed, it is requesting density bonus waivers and a concession. Just a reminder that concessions and waivers can only be denied under very specific circumstances, including significant negative impacts to health and safety. 63 00:11:42.250 --> 00:12:01.939 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): We will summarize the 12 density bonus waivers in the following slides, though primarily we're looking at the height limitation for the part of the city, the front, side, and rear setbacks, the side and rear upper deck setbacks, eave setbacks, lot coverage, lot width, and building forms, and then parking size and setbacks. 64 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:22.809 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So here is an image that shows the 35 units that would be impacted if the heart of the City height limit of 45 feet was in place. The tallest of these units is highlighted here with Unit Building 17. It's noted that the height of the building is approximately 50 feet. 65 00:12:22.810 --> 00:12:32.199 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): While the actual structure itself is about 45 and a half feet tall, the setback is measured from the sidewalk, which does affect the overall height. 66 00:12:34.510 --> 00:12:46.179 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Here are the setbacks for the front, side, side deck, rear, and rear deck and eaves. They're showing here in the table the most, significantly reduced setback. 67 00:12:49.210 --> 00:13:03.280 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Similarly here, there are additional waivers for lot coverage, lot width, and building forms. The building form speaks to the masses… massing of the buildings adjacent to residential, which would ordinarily require the building to be stepped back based on the height. 68 00:13:05.410 --> 00:13:18.500 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): There are also two additional waivers that have to do with parking, including the construction of parking within the setback, adjacent to residential. So those are the garages for buildings 1, 2, 3, and 17. 69 00:13:18.500 --> 00:13:29.800 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Then there's also the parking stall size. The garage would typically be 20 by 20. Here, we're looking at an 18.5x20 with 28 tandem garages. 70 00:13:31.810 --> 00:13:41.870 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The project does propose public art. This would be located in the central green of the project, and ultimately this would be reviewed and approved by the Arts and Culture Commission. 71 00:13:43.630 --> 00:13:55.989 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Due to the limitations on the site, the project proposes the payment of an in-lieu fee for parkland dedication, and with this fee, it is consistent with Quimby Act requirements. 72 00:13:58.150 --> 00:14:14.540 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The proposed project will also include 20% moderate below market rate, or BMR units. This would be a total of 24.4 BMR units, so there's 12 moderate and 12 median, with an in-lieu fee paid for the fractional unit. 73 00:14:14.660 --> 00:14:30.980 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The concession for the project is proposed for the units to be slightly smaller in unit type, so there's 3 bedrooms in the BMR units, whereas 3 or 4 bedrooms in the units throughout the rest of the site, and then the BMR units are only located in the townhomes. 74 00:14:32.840 --> 00:14:50.779 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): The project, relies on the AB130 exemption. There is a memorandum included with the staff report packet. As part of that, they reviewed the Phase 1 Environmental Site Assessment, and it was determined that the project meets the requirements for the statutory exemption. 75 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:59.930 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): For noticing and public comments, the noticing includes site signage, illegal advertisement, and then the mailed notices to 500 feet. 76 00:15:00.040 --> 00:15:16.320 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Prior to staff report publication, there was only one letter that referenced the project. It was a comment about loss of retail in the city, and did mention the project, but did not address it directly. There were several emails that were received, 77 00:15:16.580 --> 00:15:26.179 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): today, and in one email yesterday, several of the emails were regarding the loss of retail, and there were also multiple letters of support in the project. 78 00:15:29.170 --> 00:15:46.629 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Therefore, staff recommends that the Planning Commission adopt the draft resolutions recommending that the City Council take the actions listed here on the slide and in your staff report. Thank you, and I'm available for questions, and PlaceWorks is also available to answer questions regarding the CEQA. So, thank you very much. 79 00:15:47.660 --> 00:15:55.230 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you for the presentation and a belated welcome to Sheldon. I'll now bring it back to the Commission for any questions of staff before we move to the applicant presentation. 80 00:15:56.240 --> 00:16:01.280 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I did not see staff call out the letter from the neighboring retail. 81 00:16:01.490 --> 00:16:04.959 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Tenant, did I miss that on your slide? If you might go back to that slide. 82 00:16:06.010 --> 00:16:11.079 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): It wasn't called out directly on the slide because it was received very late in the day today. 83 00:16:11.500 --> 00:16:12.470 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So, how short. 84 00:16:12.475 --> 00:16:16.465 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Should we think about the letter from the retail? 85 00:16:17.165 --> 00:16:20.815 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Neighbor that is asking to continue the item. 86 00:16:21.665 --> 00:16:28.275 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Commissioner, we received a letter very, very, very late, and I think it's appropriate to just proceed. 87 00:16:28.530 --> 00:16:37.789 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Under the circumstance that we haven't had time to evaluate the merits of the letter, and encouraged, the letter writer to contact the City Council. 88 00:16:38.300 --> 00:16:40.610 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): When they… when the island goes before them. 89 00:16:41.330 --> 00:16:45.750 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, and can staff comment on, in these matters, typically. 90 00:16:45.950 --> 00:16:53.330 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): If you have an applicant that is co-located with another Commercial, property owner. 91 00:16:53.630 --> 00:17:06.420 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): What is the protocol? Is it the… is the onus on the applicant to contact the neighboring property? Is the onus on the neighboring property to read their notices and engage, or is the onus on staff to engage both parties? 92 00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:23.869 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So, as proposed, the project does not modify the easement that's referred to in the letter. So, I have been told that the applicant has reached out to the property owner, but as the easement's not being modified with the project, it hasn't been an issue. 93 00:17:24.470 --> 00:17:28.039 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): But just in terms of the engagement model, is the city… 94 00:17:28.280 --> 00:17:31.230 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Expected to engage adjacent neighbors, or… 95 00:17:34.240 --> 00:17:48.020 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): On issues like this, where they're between two properties, the city would typically not be involved with an agreement where I believe there's a third party where the city had oversight when these were both commercial properties to ensure that there was access. 96 00:17:48.100 --> 00:17:57.669 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Where we're now finding ourself is it's an opposite situation, because you're having a residential property develop, where it's essentially going to be shut off from that commercial property. 97 00:17:57.780 --> 00:18:10.809 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And several of the issues, if not all, that are cited in there are really not going to be applicable anymore, because this is essentially a standalone project. But it's not impeding the access to the commercial site to the east. 98 00:18:13.530 --> 00:18:23.630 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And last question from me. So the AB130, is that retroactive, given the application was received before AB130 was passed, I believe? 99 00:18:24.415 --> 00:18:30.685 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Yes, it is. The application was filed before AB130 went into effect on June 30 of last year. 100 00:18:30.865 --> 00:18:37.954 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And projects that had already been submitted prior to that, if they were eligible, could take advantage of AB130, so… 101 00:18:38.065 --> 00:18:41.424 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): That's the course this project had taken. 102 00:18:41.915 --> 00:18:57.484 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): there was a… there's a long-standing existing categorical exemption for infill projects that was typically used. However, because this site's close to 7 acres, it wouldn't have been eligible for that. It's capped at 5. AB130 raised that up to 20 acres, so… 103 00:18:57.535 --> 00:19:02.164 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): This project meets all of the criteria of AB130. Thank you. 104 00:19:03.950 --> 00:19:05.580 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Any other questions from Commission? 105 00:19:05.690 --> 00:19:07.009 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Commissioner Linskogg? 106 00:19:07.880 --> 00:19:14.809 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I have a question about the retail. Is there any effort being made to relocate the retail, or to encourage. 107 00:19:14.810 --> 00:19:17.159 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): You know, like, give them, 108 00:19:17.400 --> 00:19:23.709 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Incentives or, or, you know, any kind of help to relocate elsewhere in the city? 109 00:19:24.830 --> 00:19:43.660 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I did not talk recently with our economic development group, but generally they are… they're well aware of this project and are generally working with tenants, where there's potential displacement to try to keep them within the city and look at available options for relocation. I don't know the specific status of those conversations, though. 110 00:19:45.840 --> 00:19:47.730 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Can we find out? Can we… 111 00:19:47.735 --> 00:19:54.304 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): We certainly can, and at the City Council meeting, we could include that in the staff presentation. 112 00:19:54.435 --> 00:19:57.754 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): On efforts to assist with relocation. 113 00:19:57.985 --> 00:19:59.334 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): That would be great, thank you. 114 00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:01.750 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Any other questions? 115 00:20:02.150 --> 00:20:03.160 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Vice Chair? 116 00:20:05.030 --> 00:20:12.520 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I just had one clarifying question. So, I understand that, 20807 is the housing element site, and then 117 00:20:12.770 --> 00:20:17.389 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): 20813, 23 and 883 are not. 118 00:20:17.520 --> 00:20:24.250 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Are those going to be counted later in… in… from a RENA standpoint? 119 00:20:24.405 --> 00:20:28.695 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Happily, yes. All of these will count, so… 120 00:20:28.905 --> 00:20:36.995 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): the housing element site's not being developed at the density we expected. I think the capacity in the housing element was 51 units for that property. 121 00:20:37.275 --> 00:20:43.594 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): But the total number of units is, what, 71 beyond that, and we're not having 122 00:20:44.005 --> 00:20:48.495 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): A contribution to no net loss in the moderate income category, though we do in the low. 123 00:20:50.290 --> 00:20:51.309 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you. 124 00:20:52.130 --> 00:20:56.060 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): All right, if we have no further questions, then… oh, sorry, it looks like we do. 125 00:20:56.065 --> 00:20:57.675 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): As a follow-up to that, I'm curious. 126 00:20:57.795 --> 00:21:02.025 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Because the other sites were not… because the other parcels were not part of the housing element. 127 00:21:02.925 --> 00:21:07.095 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Is there any effect, because there are units being built there, that that offsets the… 128 00:21:08.055 --> 00:21:11.455 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know the loss on the… on the site that had been designated? 129 00:21:11.825 --> 00:21:12.415 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): what… 130 00:21:12.420 --> 00:21:22.210 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I'm expecting we will be doing in the coming months is taking account of projects like this that were not identified in the housing element, but are either in the pipeline or going to hearing. 131 00:21:22.610 --> 00:21:34.620 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And the no-net loss will involve amending the housing element and factoring those in. So, we would get credit in the annual reporting anyway, because we've approved these, but the housing element should reflect 132 00:21:35.340 --> 00:21:43.609 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): That while we have a no-net-loss situation, we've also gotten a number of projects on non-housing element sites that will help us for total units. 133 00:21:45.970 --> 00:21:46.999 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yep, Commissioner Rao. 134 00:21:48.100 --> 00:21:54.929 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, so… How is, staff interpreting the… 135 00:21:56.370 --> 00:21:59.739 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Use of objective design standards, or the lack thereof. 136 00:22:02.630 --> 00:22:09.519 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Do we assume the city has no objective design standards, or do we… To review specific… 137 00:22:09.710 --> 00:22:13.150 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Standards within the general plan and other plans. 138 00:22:13.370 --> 00:22:16.839 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): To see which ones are actually quantified and therefore enforceable. 139 00:22:18.080 --> 00:22:23.109 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Yes, we do look at that. Of course, with density bonus projects. 140 00:22:23.670 --> 00:22:27.789 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): We're always dealing with even the objective standards can be waived. 141 00:22:28.340 --> 00:22:37.289 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Understood, but, specific, quantifiable standards would still need explicit density bonus waivers being requested. 142 00:22:38.030 --> 00:22:44.640 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And anything that is quantifiable and applicable to the project, yes. Things like building height, setbacks. 143 00:22:44.645 --> 00:22:47.104 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I'm not assuming that the… 144 00:22:47.275 --> 00:22:53.944 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The absence of a separate objective design standard means we cannot enforce anything that is in the 145 00:22:54.365 --> 00:22:58.205 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): In the general plan. If it is quantified, we will still be looking to enforce. If… 146 00:22:58.600 --> 00:23:03.420 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Yes, we still look to that, it's just that you should always keep in mind with density bonus. 147 00:23:03.640 --> 00:23:07.189 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): they can be waived, even the objective standards. 148 00:23:07.195 --> 00:23:11.824 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The question is, is the applicant seeking explicit waiver on each of those? 149 00:23:12.085 --> 00:23:13.255 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): RV. 150 00:23:13.405 --> 00:23:15.755 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Are we, are we looking at that? 151 00:23:16.075 --> 00:23:17.455 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Thank you, that's all I have. 152 00:23:19.290 --> 00:23:23.120 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): All right, seeing as there are no further questions, we will move to the applicant presentation. 153 00:23:29.690 --> 00:23:31.140 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Alright. 154 00:23:31.890 --> 00:23:33.910 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): You can… Pull the presentation? 155 00:23:35.780 --> 00:23:36.460 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): No. 156 00:23:39.670 --> 00:23:42.479 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): It is up on my screen, so it's ready for… 157 00:23:43.630 --> 00:23:47.230 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Can they see it on their screens? Okay. Oh, there we go. Perfect. 158 00:23:49.090 --> 00:23:50.120 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Good evening. 159 00:23:50.340 --> 00:23:52.959 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Chair Cultron, Vice Chair Scharf, and Commissioner. 160 00:23:52.965 --> 00:23:54.975 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): And members of the public. 161 00:23:55.370 --> 00:23:57.759 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I'm Kevin Choi with Harvest Properties. 162 00:23:58.420 --> 00:24:04.189 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I'd like to first like to thank staff for their presentation and their guidance through this entitlement process. 163 00:24:04.370 --> 00:24:06.780 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): They have been incredibly helpful throughout all of it. 164 00:24:08.420 --> 00:24:11.699 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): We are excited to present and introduce the canopies. 165 00:24:11.890 --> 00:24:19.279 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): There was no time like today to name the project, and the canopies, as staff has mentioned, is located on Stevens Creek Boulevard. 166 00:24:19.350 --> 00:24:20.030 Community Hall: Excellent. 167 00:24:21.700 --> 00:24:26.769 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Tonight, I'll briefly walk you through our project team, the site location. 168 00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:32.370 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Our community engagement process, and the core benefits this housing project brings Cupertino. 169 00:24:33.360 --> 00:24:39.740 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Then I'll hand it over to our architect to dive into the design, Landscaping, and architecture. 170 00:24:41.920 --> 00:24:47.279 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Before we jump in… I just want to quickly introduce our project team. Again, my name is Kevin Choi. 171 00:24:47.640 --> 00:24:49.070 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Representing ownership. 172 00:24:49.640 --> 00:24:52.710 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): With me tonight is the property owner, Blair Volkman. 173 00:24:53.010 --> 00:24:56.309 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Whose family has been stewards of the site for over 40 plus years. 174 00:24:56.800 --> 00:25:04.040 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): We also have our lead design and engineering partners, David Burton from KTGY Architecture, Eric Gellerman from Gates Studio. 175 00:25:04.630 --> 00:25:07.250 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Terry Reeves from CBMG. 176 00:25:09.070 --> 00:25:09.630 Community Hall: Next step. 177 00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:19.330 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Looking at the project location, this 6.8- acre site is currently improved with older office and retail buildings. 178 00:25:19.520 --> 00:25:35.450 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I want to explicitly clarify, especially in response to some public comments that we have received, that our project footprint does not include the daycare facility at the corner of Alves and Sage, nor does it include the newly constructed retail shops fronting Sageway and the associated driveway. 179 00:25:37.000 --> 00:25:54.289 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): As you'll hear later, our project includes for-sale residential units, and these future homeowners will have ample access to schools and retail amenities, including Garden Gate Elementary, Sam Lawson Middle School, Whole Foods, Target, and a variety of other retail tenants in Cupertino. 180 00:25:56.750 --> 00:26:01.300 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Getting to the proposed site plan to you today, Has been a comprehensive journey. 181 00:26:01.900 --> 00:26:11.139 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Since submitting our initial SB330 application in April of 2024, we have had significant community engagement throughout 2024 and 2025. 182 00:26:11.520 --> 00:26:22.929 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): We listened closely to feedback, which led our team to spend several months through March and July of 2025 deeply investigating a site design alternative that preserved the existing retail on-site. 183 00:26:23.570 --> 00:26:32.550 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Unfortunately, due to a determination that the project would have to resubmit and lose its SB330 vesting, that option ultimately proved infeasible. 184 00:26:34.970 --> 00:26:38.079 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): That brings us to what we have heard from the community. 185 00:26:38.340 --> 00:26:47.370 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): While we couldn't preserve the retail buildings, ownership is committed to working with Panera and Voyager Coffee to assist them in finding a new home in Cupertino. 186 00:26:48.360 --> 00:26:51.879 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): We've also heard how much the community values the urban forest. 187 00:26:52.060 --> 00:27:00.980 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): We worked closely with city staff, and are proudly preserving 6 existing pear trees along Stevens Creek Boulevard frontage, and we'll be planting an additional 4 more. 188 00:27:01.800 --> 00:27:12.189 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Regarding the site's interior, the current high volume of trees is solely due to severe overplanting in areas that are too small to support mature growth. 189 00:27:12.840 --> 00:27:23.509 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Rather than repeat past mistakes, we are planting 65 new, large canopy trees in right-sized courtyards to ensure a sustainable, healthy canopy for the long term. 190 00:27:26.070 --> 00:27:29.399 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I want to highlight the unique opportunity that we have here. 191 00:27:29.610 --> 00:27:34.300 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): For sale homes have been severely underproduced in this region over the last decade. 192 00:27:34.410 --> 00:27:37.359 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): With development heavily skewed towards rentals. 193 00:27:40.210 --> 00:27:43.840 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): This project helps meet that missing supply for home ownership. 194 00:27:43.940 --> 00:27:49.150 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Providing a place for families to put down roots, and for empty nesters to downsize. 195 00:27:49.680 --> 00:27:55.329 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): This opportunity exists because the 40-plus- year-old campus is at the end of its useful life. 196 00:27:55.720 --> 00:28:00.680 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): And Apple, who occupies 65% of the site, has notified us that they are vacating. 197 00:28:01.120 --> 00:28:04.499 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): And the demand for office like this has fundamentally changed. 198 00:28:05.480 --> 00:28:15.370 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): To deliver this much-needed housing, we are utilizing state density bonus law, while still maintaining a relatively low density development in comparison to other projects. 199 00:28:15.750 --> 00:28:30.410 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): To make our affordable housing units physically and financially feasible, we are requesting a concession and multiple waivers. These waivers, which include deviations for height, lock coverage, setbacks, and parking dimensions that staff has mentioned, are not arbitrary. 200 00:28:30.510 --> 00:28:36.300 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): They are essential mechanical tools that allow us to provide the level of housing and affordability today. 201 00:28:38.410 --> 00:28:53.500 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Finally, before I turn it over to David, I want to emphasize the benefits of this project. By utilizing these state density bonus law provisions, we are providing 24 below-market rate homes, 20% of the total units, to median and moderate-income households. 202 00:28:53.930 --> 00:28:57.130 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Additionally, we're providing 122 homes. 203 00:28:57.370 --> 00:29:05.869 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): That's more than the 51 that was noted in the housing element, as you all have already noticed. And this will help with the low net loss issue that you have. 204 00:29:06.510 --> 00:29:14.979 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Beyond housing, this project is a tremendous asset to the city. It is entirely consistent with the site's general plan and zoning designations when submitted. 205 00:29:15.240 --> 00:29:33.560 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Environmentally, our peer-reviewed traffic study demonstrates a 40% net decrease in vehicle trips compared to the existing commercial uses. And last but not least, economically, the project generates $10 million in impact fees and provides an estimated $160,000 of net revenue to the city's general fund. 206 00:29:34.430 --> 00:29:39.829 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Thank you for your time and consideration. I'll now hand the presentation over to David Burton from KTGY Architects. 207 00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:45.300 Community Hall: Excellent. 208 00:29:46.530 --> 00:29:50.730 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Thanks, Kevin. And good evening to all of you, Commissioners. 209 00:29:50.840 --> 00:29:52.520 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Definitely excited to be, before you. 210 00:29:52.520 --> 00:29:56.299 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): This evening to present what we think will be a great addition to the neighborhood. 211 00:29:56.400 --> 00:30:00.900 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): As Kevin mentioned, my name's David Burton. I'm Associate Principal with KTGY. 212 00:30:02.070 --> 00:30:08.820 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): I'll keep my presentation short, focusing on giving you some small insights into our thinking that went into developing the designs. 213 00:30:10.290 --> 00:30:23.039 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Our main goals with this design were, one, to create a plan that responds to the context, larger-scale buildings facing Stevens Creek Boulevard, transitioning to a more fine-grained scale as you move through the site to Alice Drive. 214 00:30:23.780 --> 00:30:28.879 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Number two was to help fulfill the vision of the city's Heart of the City specific plan. 215 00:30:29.520 --> 00:30:38.519 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): And three is to maximize housing opportunities in a location that's got good access to shopping, schools, transit, and bike infrastructure, as Kevin talked about. 216 00:30:40.730 --> 00:30:43.230 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The project concludes two types of housing. 217 00:30:43.360 --> 00:30:50.919 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): 3-story townhouses that are oriented towards Stevens Creek Boulevard, three-story single-family homes towards the interior, and facing Alves Drive. 218 00:30:51.390 --> 00:31:02.199 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Access to the site is provided from both of these streets, and we've then meandered that circulation through the site to encourage slower speeds more conducive to a pedestrian-friendly neighborhood. 219 00:31:03.310 --> 00:31:09.700 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): All homes have front doors facing Stevens Creek, Alves Drive, or to the landscape courtyards that we've created. 220 00:31:10.440 --> 00:31:18.909 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The courtyards connect to the central circulation spine and provide a strong continuous pedestrian connection from homes out to the larger neighborhood. 221 00:31:20.470 --> 00:31:29.800 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The 56 townhomes are a mix of 3- and 4- bedroom units that provide a diversity of plans that can appeal to a wide variety of households and lifestyles. 222 00:31:29.900 --> 00:31:41.310 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): And the 66 single-family homes have two primary unit types, a couple different little variations. And the homes will have private side yards and second floor decks that connect with the main living spaces. 223 00:31:41.770 --> 00:31:45.730 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): And as Kevin, I think, pointed out, that the number of the homes also feature roof decks. 224 00:31:48.080 --> 00:31:49.350 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Next slide, please. 225 00:31:50.990 --> 00:31:57.260 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): As I mentioned a minute ago, all homes have front doors that either face one of the two public streets or face onto landscape courtyards. 226 00:31:58.440 --> 00:32:07.870 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): We worked very closely with Gate Studios, the landscape architects, to design streetscapes and courtyards that are human-scale, lush. 227 00:32:07.990 --> 00:32:16.399 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Provide gathering spaces for friends and neighbors, and create a network of walkways that connect homes to the landscape and to the larger neighborhood. 228 00:32:17.420 --> 00:32:31.029 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The highlight of the neighborhood and its heart is a large 32,000 square foot courtyard that will feature a substantial tree canopy, picnic areas, an outdoor workstation, play opportunities for children, and public art. 229 00:32:31.610 --> 00:32:40.189 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): This courtyard is situated well away from both Stevens Creek Boulevard and Alves Drive to be a quiet, peaceful space for residents away from car traffic. 230 00:32:40.310 --> 00:32:46.980 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): But that it's also connected by the strong central circulation spine for easy, visible access. 231 00:32:48.040 --> 00:32:58.770 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Our other courtyards, which feed off the central circulation spine, include benches, seat walls, playful seating stones, and gathering areas for quiet outdoor time and conversation with neighbors. 232 00:32:59.350 --> 00:33:00.180 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Next. 233 00:33:03.330 --> 00:33:03.850 Community Hall: Nope. 234 00:33:05.690 --> 00:33:07.350 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): There we go. 235 00:33:07.480 --> 00:33:21.029 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The townhomes are designed in two distinct styles, and have plane breaks, varied roof heights, changes in materials, and changes in color to be compliant with the design guidelines in the Heart of the City-specific plan. 236 00:33:21.480 --> 00:33:26.980 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): This view shows our Stevens Creek frontage that we, for a lack of a better term, call our modern French style. 237 00:33:27.820 --> 00:33:32.170 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Lighter colors are used at street-facing bays to highlight individual units. 238 00:33:32.460 --> 00:33:40.999 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Lower, one-in-storic, two-story forms with standing seam metal roofs give prominence and a more pedestrian-friendly scale to the front doors of all the homes. 239 00:33:41.480 --> 00:33:46.940 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Recessed windows, bay windows, and balconies add depth and detail to the elevations. 240 00:33:48.070 --> 00:33:55.429 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): And as, Kevin pointed out, at the planting strip along the street, we're preserving 6 existing street trees and infilling with matching trees. 241 00:33:55.660 --> 00:34:02.520 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): This existing landscape, paired with our more traditional architecture, we feel will help give these buildings a more timeless quality. 242 00:34:03.370 --> 00:34:03.980 Community Hall: Next. 243 00:34:06.260 --> 00:34:15.130 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The single-family homes are designed in three styles that are distinct, but also share common compositional elements that allow them to come together as a cohesive neighborhood. 244 00:34:15.800 --> 00:34:19.920 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): This view of our Alves Drive street frontage shows an example of each of the styles. 245 00:34:20.520 --> 00:34:27.009 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The Spanish Revival style features low- pitched roofs, arched entries, and recessed windows, typical of the style. 246 00:34:27.170 --> 00:34:32.110 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The modern French utilizes steeper gaveled grooves and fiber cement panel accents. 247 00:34:32.420 --> 00:34:39.739 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): And the craftsman style features deep eaves, brackets, corbels, and shingle accents, typical of the style. 248 00:34:40.260 --> 00:34:47.170 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Each home has a prominent front porch and a second floor deck that allows the main living spaces to have engagement with the life of the street. 249 00:34:47.560 --> 00:34:58.829 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): The front elevations of the homes have significant plain changes, varied roof lines, bay windows, and changes in material and colors to give the homes great visual interest and a more human scale. 250 00:34:59.370 --> 00:35:06.180 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): We believe that the style and play of masting and details will allow these houses to blend comfortably with the existing neighborhood. 251 00:35:07.000 --> 00:35:07.590 Community Hall: Next. 252 00:35:11.550 --> 00:35:13.470 Community Hall: One before this. 253 00:35:16.560 --> 00:35:21.640 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Let me keep going back. Is there… Huh, there was one of the courtyards somewhere in there. 254 00:35:22.890 --> 00:35:25.129 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): There… oh, there it is. 255 00:35:25.300 --> 00:35:37.809 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): And this is a view of our central open space. At this location, our two housing typologies come together, with the space being bounded by both townhomes and single-family homes. The whole of the community literally knits together in this space. 256 00:35:38.620 --> 00:35:44.970 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): You can also see we've made the space large enough for it to be a vibrant space that contains multiple spaces and uses. 257 00:35:45.210 --> 00:35:50.079 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Space for children to play, neighbors to chat, or to have a little quiet time for oneself. 258 00:35:52.430 --> 00:35:59.169 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): There we go. With that, I'll conclude my portion of our presentation. Thanks for the opportunity to present the project to you this evening. 259 00:35:59.310 --> 00:36:04.740 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Our team, both the ownership and the consultants, are here and available to answer questions you might have. 260 00:36:04.920 --> 00:36:05.690 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): Thanks. 261 00:36:06.560 --> 00:36:10.429 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you very much to Kevin and David, and we'll bring it back to the Commission for questions. 262 00:36:11.770 --> 00:36:12.680 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Fisher? 263 00:36:13.570 --> 00:36:16.330 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): How far are the front doors of the units? 264 00:36:16.700 --> 00:36:18.150 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Facing Stevens Creek. 265 00:36:18.155 --> 00:36:24.695 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): From the actual… road, because I noticed Stevens Creek is between 6 and 7-lane divided. 266 00:36:25.185 --> 00:36:29.654 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): highway there, so I just wonder how many feet those… Are from the street. 267 00:36:29.660 --> 00:36:42.690 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): It's a great question. There's a required, I think it's 35-foot setback, along that frontage, and we're complying with that… with that setback. So there's setback a good ways, and there's a big landscape buffer in between the street and the buildings. Okay, thank… 268 00:36:43.420 --> 00:36:44.460 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): 34? 269 00:36:45.500 --> 00:36:46.609 Speaker 11 (Community Hall): One foot less. 270 00:36:49.430 --> 00:36:55.119 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. Any other questions? And the applicant may want to remain at the podium, as we may have more questions for you. 271 00:36:55.905 --> 00:36:58.735 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): I have a question about the trees. 272 00:36:58.845 --> 00:37:18.845 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): There's a… I mean, I hear what you're saying about some of the trees are pretty close together, but there's also a lot of really nice, mature pine trees and big, beautiful trees there, which I'm really not happy about losing. What size trees are you going to be putting back in? Are you making an effort to put 273 00:37:18.985 --> 00:37:23.574 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Bigger trees in, or are these, like, you know, 24-inch… 274 00:37:24.380 --> 00:37:26.700 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Pods. 275 00:37:27.030 --> 00:37:33.319 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): the exact size of the particular tree. 24- inch box is a pretty standard size for new trees going in, as far. 276 00:37:33.320 --> 00:37:35.069 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): As far as, the species. 277 00:37:35.075 --> 00:37:49.645 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): that go in, but given the type of project, we have trees that are kind of small to medium size in mature canopy, and then the areas where we do have room. I think we do have, like, at least one oak species and a couple other species that would be large shade trees at maturity. 278 00:37:51.235 --> 00:37:52.624 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): Where are those going? 279 00:37:53.065 --> 00:38:01.125 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): The central courtyard, the linear park area, that's where we have the most space for the larger canopy. There's a couple other pockets where… How wide is the central courtyard? 280 00:38:02.325 --> 00:38:03.994 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): 50 feet, give or take? 281 00:38:05.335 --> 00:38:06.125 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): Okay. 282 00:38:08.570 --> 00:38:10.210 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Do we have any other questions? 283 00:38:13.330 --> 00:38:14.290 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Commissioner Rowe? 284 00:38:15.290 --> 00:38:17.570 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, question to staff. 285 00:38:17.900 --> 00:38:21.909 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is now the time to invite the… 286 00:38:22.270 --> 00:38:26.049 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Retail neighbor, if they're available, to speak. 287 00:38:26.360 --> 00:38:28.620 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Or would we have to wait for oral comments? 288 00:38:29.100 --> 00:38:30.890 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I don't know if they're available, though. 289 00:38:31.330 --> 00:38:36.250 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Do we see the… Maybe a question for staff first? 290 00:38:40.570 --> 00:38:41.090 Community Hall: Bye. 291 00:38:42.300 --> 00:38:45.960 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can someone confirm if they are on the call, and if they are, are they allowed to speak now? 292 00:38:46.280 --> 00:38:47.130 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Looks like it's. 293 00:38:47.135 --> 00:38:51.865 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): gone to me. I don't know if they're here, because I haven't seen them, 294 00:38:52.505 --> 00:38:58.294 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think if you wanted to allow them to speak either at this time or under oral communications, either would be fine. 295 00:38:58.295 --> 00:39:01.295 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): staff on Zoom and able to check Zoom attendees? 296 00:39:01.295 --> 00:39:18.835 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): excuse me, I think I'm going to recommend to have them speak their oral comment, just public comment, just like, you know, all the other parties who have interest in the party in this project will be able to do so. There may be other neighbors who have comments, and I think we should provide them the courtesy to have just one set of, 297 00:39:18.845 --> 00:39:21.574 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Of, of a process for them to follow. 298 00:39:21.605 --> 00:39:22.535 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): It may be. 299 00:39:23.005 --> 00:39:24.534 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): More straightforward that way. 300 00:39:25.990 --> 00:39:26.670 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay. 301 00:39:27.470 --> 00:39:35.170 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Follow-up question, so… What is the mullen density for this project, and does the project qualify? 302 00:39:35.880 --> 00:39:45.429 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Mullen density throughout Cupertino is 30, so for AB130, you have to be half the mullen density of 15 units per acre, so they are over that. 303 00:39:46.050 --> 00:39:50.969 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And what is the basis for that 30… Can you explain? 304 00:39:52.120 --> 00:40:03.029 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Mullen density varies throughout the state, and it's based on if you're in an urbanized area, your density is generally 30. I know there can be variations on this. 305 00:40:03.120 --> 00:40:21.940 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And as far as AB130, the significance that's tied to that is in order to qualify, you have to be at least 50% of the mullen density, so it's aimed at multifamily projects. Lower density projects would not be able to take advantage of AB130, because they typically don't meet the half of the mullen density. 306 00:40:23.760 --> 00:40:28.309 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And on the density bonus waivers and incentives. 307 00:40:29.740 --> 00:40:34.120 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Procedurally, how would staff make a determination 308 00:40:34.710 --> 00:40:41.049 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): to write up that there is a specific adverse impact. For example, the loss of retail, maybe. I'll just pick on one. 309 00:40:41.270 --> 00:40:47.660 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is there a way that staff would make a determination to decide to write up a specific adverse impact on 310 00:40:48.160 --> 00:40:50.879 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the health of the public for having lost Voyager. 311 00:40:51.500 --> 00:40:53.140 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I'll just take that as an example. 312 00:40:54.700 --> 00:41:08.549 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So, the significant and adverse impacts are towards maintaining a historic structure or public health and safety. I don't know that the loss of retail would meet any of those criteria. 313 00:41:08.815 --> 00:41:16.855 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): CEQA has never contemplated economic impacts or even social impacts. It was purely focused on 314 00:41:17.075 --> 00:41:19.815 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Physical impacts to the environment. 315 00:41:19.815 --> 00:41:26.804 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): But specifically, I'm asking about public health in the context of loss of something as dearly loud as white hair, for example. 316 00:41:28.150 --> 00:41:44.580 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): That would be an interesting nexus to make. I've never seen anything on that, that the loss of retail is actually an impact to public health. I think loss of retail is a real impact to cities, but not necessarily an environmental one. 317 00:41:45.560 --> 00:41:47.749 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): But is there a process by which… 318 00:41:48.450 --> 00:41:55.589 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Commission may direct staff to look into the possibility of such a… Potential written investigation. 319 00:41:57.570 --> 00:42:02.510 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I assume with AB130, you have no lead time to… Follow such direction. 320 00:42:03.050 --> 00:42:13.210 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): under AB130, and this project in particular, we are pretty much at the limit, which is why we're actually scheduling a shorter-than-usual 321 00:42:13.450 --> 00:42:16.719 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): hearing time before the City Council on April 7th. 322 00:42:17.340 --> 00:42:23.250 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And so the assumption here is that council or commissions Shall not have… 323 00:42:23.770 --> 00:42:31.730 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the ability to direct staff on this matter. This would be staff's discretion to sort of independently assess, in their professional opinion, if 324 00:42:32.230 --> 00:42:38.159 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): a health or safety issue is warranted, and therefore, you would write something up. Is that fair? 325 00:42:39.110 --> 00:42:54.230 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): with all CEQA clearances, if there was a genuine health and safety issue, that's something we would be looked at, and if one existed, you wouldn't be using an exemption, typically. You'd be doing a higher level CEQA document for something where there was a definite health and safety issue. 326 00:42:55.970 --> 00:43:01.490 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And is the burden of proof solely on the city for this aspect, or is that also… 327 00:43:01.680 --> 00:43:05.499 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Any burden of proof on the applicant to prove that they actually needed this. 328 00:43:06.880 --> 00:43:09.990 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): I believe it's on the city. Yeah, it's not on the applicant. 329 00:43:10.390 --> 00:43:18.409 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is the applicant required to show that this is a… this is required to make the project feasible financially, or that it produces cost savings, or… 330 00:43:20.100 --> 00:43:26.299 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think in a general sense, and now I think we've kind of segued from maybe 130 to density bonus. 331 00:43:26.820 --> 00:43:33.470 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): The burden lies with the city if you're challenging, to be able to make specific findings that 332 00:43:33.980 --> 00:43:45.949 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): if you're going after, economic feasibility, to be able to point out that the waiver or concession being asked for is not necessary. The burden is with the city. 333 00:43:46.525 --> 00:43:57.195 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Understood, but along with the request for the waivers and incentives, are they required to provide written evidence of why, without that waiver or incentive, the project would be infeasible? 334 00:43:59.990 --> 00:44:04.809 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I guess to what degree of specificity? The applicants do state why 335 00:44:05.070 --> 00:44:12.469 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): they need a certain waiver and how it would impact their project, I think, such as some of the diagrams presented show. Loss of units. 336 00:44:12.580 --> 00:44:18.829 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Which is a typical… it would be something physically… Altering the project. 337 00:44:19.050 --> 00:44:26.279 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Cities are not in a position to kind of redesign a project and say, our design actually meets your goals. 338 00:44:26.390 --> 00:44:29.889 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): You're looking at the project as design. Density bonus… 339 00:44:30.410 --> 00:44:34.329 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Puts that in the applicant's court to propose their project. 340 00:44:34.790 --> 00:44:40.390 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And we can't sort of presuppose that an equivalent design would meet those same standards. 341 00:44:40.565 --> 00:44:44.574 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is there a particular item out of the waiver list that we might 342 00:44:44.945 --> 00:44:47.414 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): You know, call out, for example, the 50 feet height. 343 00:44:48.255 --> 00:44:51.974 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Would we… if the applicant asked for 100 feet height, would we allow that? 344 00:44:52.770 --> 00:44:55.360 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): They're only asking for 50 tonight. I know. 345 00:44:55.665 --> 00:44:59.234 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): You know, they might come back for the next project with 100, would we allow that? 346 00:44:59.555 --> 00:45:01.705 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): It would depend on the circumstances. 347 00:45:03.930 --> 00:45:10.119 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Depend on what the zoning is, depend on the circumstances, depend on the nature of the project. So, there is no… 348 00:45:10.710 --> 00:45:12.700 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Control the city has on… 349 00:45:13.090 --> 00:45:19.580 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Because we, on a prior project, were debating 30 feet versus 40 feet, and here we are at 50 feet. 350 00:45:19.870 --> 00:45:21.460 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): For, 351 00:45:21.840 --> 00:45:26.950 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): purpose of comparison, what is the height on the Westport Senior Living? I think that is the tallest we have. 352 00:45:27.950 --> 00:45:32.410 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): 70 feet? 72, something like that, it was just over 70. 353 00:45:32.530 --> 00:45:36.189 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): For this project, though, the heart of the City allowed up 45. 354 00:45:36.660 --> 00:45:41.639 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): So, some of the buildings are under that. A few are over, the tallest is 5 feet over. 355 00:45:42.075 --> 00:45:46.014 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And that height limit assumes commercial zoning, or… 356 00:45:46.235 --> 00:45:48.445 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Mixed deuce. Mixed deuce, okay. 357 00:45:50.285 --> 00:45:52.375 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, I'll pause here, no further questions. 358 00:45:52.690 --> 00:46:07.000 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I did have some questions for the applicant. First, I noticed in the plan set that the townhomes are HOA, but the single-family homes are not HOA, so I was curious… well, that… did I read that correctly? Or is everything under the HOA? 359 00:46:07.490 --> 00:46:14.609 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, alright, then, we'll move on. I was also curious, could you confirm the number of guest parking spots? 360 00:46:15.040 --> 00:46:17.130 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I believe that number's 28. 361 00:46:17.590 --> 00:46:28.460 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Would you be able to show that on the diagram? Because I was counting fewer than 28, but I'm wondering if maybe they were not all on the diagram, or I was just missing some? 362 00:46:28.995 --> 00:46:32.055 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): The easiest way to do that would be to pull up the… 363 00:46:32.995 --> 00:46:35.585 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Architecture plans? How easy is that for you? 364 00:46:37.385 --> 00:46:40.795 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): A0… no. 365 00:46:41.225 --> 00:46:42.864 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Then on… I don't have the individual. 366 00:46:42.865 --> 00:46:46.485 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): sheets available, I can only bring up the site plan in your presentation. 367 00:46:46.490 --> 00:46:54.410 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): This'll work. Actually, if you can go… it's even easier. If you go to slide 8, the project introduction opportunity slide. 368 00:46:55.510 --> 00:47:02.550 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): So you can see here the, the dark rectangles that follow the streets. 369 00:47:03.320 --> 00:47:11.590 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Those are a graphical representation of the stalls there. There is one… there are a couple other stalls that are head-in. 370 00:47:11.750 --> 00:47:17.110 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): That are by the public park. There's, kind of… sorry, the… where the public pros… 371 00:47:17.320 --> 00:47:23.720 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): public art is. There's two there, and then there's one tucked away Next to Townhome. 372 00:47:25.120 --> 00:47:31.050 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): 3, which is… Okay, thank you. I had missed the ones next to the public art, so that's where the 3 came from. Thank you. 373 00:47:31.380 --> 00:47:48.919 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): And then I also wanted to confirm on L10, there is a discussion, or there's a page around landscaping around the fire ladder pads, since this project is somewhat reliant on the fire ladders. So, would… would there be empty areas where there's no landscaping to allow for those? Yes. 374 00:47:48.920 --> 00:47:57.510 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Yeah, so per code, the fire ladder pad would be devoid of landscaping, and there would be a pathway from the sidewalk to that. That is also… 375 00:47:57.870 --> 00:48:06.770 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, thank you. Would you be able to speak to the retail sport specifically that you're providing to the Panera and Voyager? I think there's a lot of community interest in that. 376 00:48:09.340 --> 00:48:26.219 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Can you, repeat the question? Oh, yes, would you be able to speak, in more detail about the support that you're providing to the Panera and Voyager to help them relocate somewhere within Cupertino? Sure. Honestly, the conversation with Panera hasn't even occurred yet. With the ownership. 377 00:48:26.220 --> 00:48:43.389 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): you know, we've been on percentage rent since COVID, and they had originally indicated that they weren't able to pay full rent at the property, so we're planning to have that conversation once we know that this is ultimately approved. With Voyager, we reached out, and we have connected with them. 378 00:48:43.390 --> 00:48:49.660 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): You know, when we first, signed this lease, it was contemplated that we might redevelop this property at some point. 379 00:48:49.660 --> 00:48:57.530 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Just knowing the age of the property. And so, in the lease, there is actually termination language if a redevelopment would occur. 380 00:48:57.530 --> 00:49:21.380 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): And we would be paying the amortized costs associated with their tenant improvements. With that being said, knowing how important Voyager is to the community, we haven't settled on a number or anything, but we've offered to assist them in additional relocation costs. And, you know, we were talking outside earlier, and I said, you know, ahead of going to City Council, happy to be explicit about what that is, so that, you know, we've got 381 00:49:21.380 --> 00:49:23.329 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): A definitive agreement stating that. 382 00:49:24.050 --> 00:49:31.939 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you. And to confirm, you… the relocation costs would go towards a new location in Cupertino, hypothetically? 383 00:49:31.940 --> 00:49:37.909 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): up to Voyager, but yes, they would go towards the build-out of a new location. Okay. That's correct. 384 00:49:37.915 --> 00:49:54.275 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. And then my final question, then I'll turn it back to the Commission, was just, I did notice that the one unit, unit number one, actually, that's adjacent to a single-family home, has no landscaping on it, and… or not landscaping, but there's no, 385 00:49:54.585 --> 00:49:57.124 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Like, tree or privacy hedge. 386 00:49:57.245 --> 00:50:05.514 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): blocking Unit 1 from the single-family residential, and I was wondering if there's a way to include a little bit more landscaping. 387 00:50:05.715 --> 00:50:06.495 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Alright. 388 00:50:06.500 --> 00:50:12.360 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): If I may, they are retaining two existing trees. Two trees, yes, in that northwest corner. 389 00:50:12.490 --> 00:50:14.039 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Right, but there's nothing between. 390 00:50:14.040 --> 00:50:16.959 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): the unit, the building, yes. 391 00:50:17.710 --> 00:50:28.399 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I think that's where we, did include a new privacy hedge that is going to be in between the, you know, right next to the fence, between the fence and our unit. 392 00:50:29.010 --> 00:50:34.719 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, and how tall would that hedge be? Would it be above the fence at all, or… I think that would be the goal. Okay. 393 00:50:35.280 --> 00:50:35.910 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Yeah. 394 00:50:36.760 --> 00:50:37.500 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Okay. 395 00:50:37.930 --> 00:50:39.310 Community Hall: Great, thank you. 396 00:50:39.460 --> 00:50:40.359 Community Hall: Vice Chair. 397 00:50:41.880 --> 00:50:47.259 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So, since one of the waivers is to under- park the project, I'm wondering 398 00:50:47.380 --> 00:50:52.310 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Are the guest spaces going to be strictly limited to guests only? 399 00:50:52.430 --> 00:50:56.670 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So residents can't use them for extra vehicles? 400 00:50:57.890 --> 00:51:05.019 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): So that would be under the choice of the HOA as to how they want to use it, but the intent is that those are 28 stalls that are to be used for guests. 401 00:51:05.565 --> 00:51:11.285 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Okay, and then this is to staff more. Because of the under-parking. 402 00:51:11.735 --> 00:51:19.195 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): what would be required to have permit parking on Alves Drive, and the time-limited parking on Sayich Way. 403 00:51:19.415 --> 00:51:24.814 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): To prevent those streets from being used as parking lots for this project. 404 00:51:26.260 --> 00:51:40.150 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Yeah, to answer that, I'd have to talk to our Transportation Division about what would be involved getting the permit parking along those streets. First, it would be involved talking to the people who live along those streets and their interest in the permit parking. 405 00:51:40.470 --> 00:51:43.239 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): But that would be a question for our transportation. 406 00:51:43.245 --> 00:51:46.895 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I guess that's for Alves. I'm thinking of, you know, Sayich, where… 407 00:51:47.355 --> 00:51:53.695 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): some of that street parking is needed for retail, I would hate to see that just being used for 408 00:51:53.955 --> 00:51:58.665 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): overflow parking from this project, so it's… but it's also the transportation. 409 00:51:59.085 --> 00:52:01.245 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Division that would look at that? 410 00:52:01.245 --> 00:52:05.395 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): street parking is, yeah, that would all be through Public Works and Transportation. Okay, thank you. 411 00:52:07.610 --> 00:52:09.250 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Any other questions from the Commission? 412 00:52:09.940 --> 00:52:10.950 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Sure. Yes. 413 00:52:11.280 --> 00:52:15.740 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So, there is a table about tree removal and trees required. 414 00:52:16.220 --> 00:52:23.349 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Usually, that table also includes trees proposed, or trees that will be provided, is that right? I don't see that column. 415 00:52:25.690 --> 00:52:34.169 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I'm trying to understand the purpose of this table. It says number of trees proposed for removal, replacement trees required, but it's missing the key 416 00:52:34.450 --> 00:52:37.179 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Data on how many replacement trees are proposed. 417 00:52:38.810 --> 00:52:41.949 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I believe the text says 151. Yes, right. 418 00:52:41.955 --> 00:52:45.135 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Understood, but is there a reason the table doesn't show that? 419 00:52:47.395 --> 00:52:55.564 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So, how many trees… I guess we have 134 trees, That need to be replaced. 420 00:52:56.465 --> 00:53:02.704 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That are 12 inches or less, and then 74… That are 24-inch. 421 00:53:03.475 --> 00:53:05.694 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And 37 out of 36 inch. 422 00:53:08.065 --> 00:53:12.674 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): What is the equivalent for each of those that are accurately provide… are proposed? 423 00:53:13.730 --> 00:53:31.329 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So, because of the limitations of the site, they are only proposing the 151. That's going to be split up between those sizes, and then the remainder's with the payment of an in-lieu fee. So this just was determined not to be physically possible to do a one- for-one replacement planting. 424 00:53:33.240 --> 00:53:37.829 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And what measures does staff have to try and increase, or… 425 00:53:38.140 --> 00:53:41.589 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Minimize the amount of loss of trees, if anything. 426 00:53:42.030 --> 00:53:53.780 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is this a… is this a waiver that they choose to just pay the fee and we have to accept it, or do we have any discretion to deny accepting that fee and require some larger number of trees? 427 00:53:54.960 --> 00:54:06.460 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think we like to save on-site trees, but where you're having a complete redevelopment of a site, that's where you're gonna lose trees, unless there's some workaround, where you actually have a tree, say. 428 00:54:06.800 --> 00:54:15.809 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): In a path of a drive aisle or an area that's remaining open space. But generally, this is typical where you have a commercial center that has a lot of surface parking. 429 00:54:16.080 --> 00:54:24.039 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): and you're now having a more dense project go in, there's just fewer spaces to accommodate the trees. Or, I think even larger trees 430 00:54:24.330 --> 00:54:28.170 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): At maturity, you have limited areas where you can plant those. 431 00:54:29.080 --> 00:54:34.680 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And the 18 off-site trees, are we preserving? I'm not sure I understand this, so… 432 00:54:35.160 --> 00:54:37.730 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): How many of these off-site trees are being preserved? 433 00:54:37.840 --> 00:54:40.360 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And the applicant can feel free to answer. 434 00:54:40.365 --> 00:54:45.674 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): preserving, the 12, I believe, on the adjacent properties, and then 6 along the street. 435 00:54:46.520 --> 00:54:49.280 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So all 18 off-site trees will be preserved? Yes. 436 00:54:52.010 --> 00:54:57.859 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And to the applicant, is there anything you might consider in terms of the 251 trees that 437 00:54:58.280 --> 00:55:01.280 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Or on-site are the trees that could have been saved. 438 00:55:01.450 --> 00:55:06.060 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That may be alternatives. I don't know if you have your landscape architect here who can speak to this. 439 00:55:08.860 --> 00:55:16.689 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can you repeat the question? Does the landscape architect have any potential options to save any of these trees that we're losing? 440 00:55:17.960 --> 00:55:26.100 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): given the current development, not really. There's some trees that are maybe on the borderline, and it's like, it's possible a tree could be saved. 441 00:55:27.640 --> 00:55:44.049 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): But as with the development, you know, excavation for foundations, things like that, tree may or may not survive, or it may be in declining health, and, you know, die 5, 10 years down the road. So there's additional complications with that, where potentially, yeah, you might be able to. 442 00:55:44.300 --> 00:55:50.710 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): But the long-term health of the tree would likely be heavily impacted, given the density of the site. 443 00:55:50.710 --> 00:55:57.160 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And so, of those potential ones that you might be able to, are there replacement trees that we might… 444 00:55:57.430 --> 00:56:00.440 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Consider in their place, or are we entirely losing the tree there? 445 00:56:01.450 --> 00:56:19.800 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): Only for the potential ones. This particular example, it was mostly just the off-site trees, and there was some, a handful of trees on both Alves and Stevens Creek that we were able to save, because the development was sufficiently far away where it was… we're very confident that the tree would survive, and still be fine, you know, into the future. Right. 446 00:56:19.805 --> 00:56:28.534 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): But of the on-site trees, are there any trees that we might, at least from a location perspective, be able to accommodate additional trees? I would say no. 447 00:56:30.055 --> 00:56:32.315 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Kevin, would you have anything to add? 448 00:56:33.630 --> 00:56:35.650 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): No, I would defer to our architect on this. 449 00:56:36.260 --> 00:56:38.109 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Okay. And I'll just say, you know, it comes down. 450 00:56:38.115 --> 00:56:41.295 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): If you might speak into the mic, please. 451 00:56:41.300 --> 00:56:57.629 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): At the end of the day, it comes down to housing density, and whether houses… more houses are worth, you know, the trees. And so we had that conversation, and there was, you know, conversation about trying to push housing density, and in order to save any of the on-site trees, you would have to eliminate housing. 452 00:56:58.910 --> 00:57:04.780 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And maybe a question for staff and the applicant. Is there a way to increase the number of off-site trees? 453 00:57:06.130 --> 00:57:12.699 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): on Stevens Creek and Al's, I know we were talking about preserving what exists, but can we add more trees off-site? 454 00:57:14.130 --> 00:57:16.779 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I don't know who can take that question, maybe the applicant might. 455 00:57:17.910 --> 00:57:27.910 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): We are adding additional trees on Stevens Creek Boulevard, so we're… there's 6 that we're preserving, and then there's 4 additional ones that are coming, on Stevens Creek Boulevard that we are adding. 456 00:57:28.860 --> 00:57:36.959 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And is that a staff recommendation? Is that the applicant's recommendation? Is there room for more trees off-site? 457 00:57:37.630 --> 00:57:52.020 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): It generally comes from Public Works, who reviews the application and handles the street trees. So we would try to retain what we can and try to add where it's appropriate, so that's a condition from Public Works review. 458 00:57:53.980 --> 00:57:59.880 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Could we condition something to recommend the… Exploration of additional off-site trees? 459 00:58:00.970 --> 00:58:07.909 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think that could be part of your recommendation, if you want to include that, along the, say, this portion of Stevens Creek. 460 00:58:08.660 --> 00:58:13.769 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Since you… you have 249 trees total, you have 151 going in. 461 00:58:13.910 --> 00:58:23.610 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think this is going to be a pretty common situation where you have a lot of building. Between the building and roadway area, you're… you're limited. I mean, to… to get… you're not going to get back to the number you had. 462 00:58:24.140 --> 00:58:40.129 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): So, if that were a discussion to try to say, can the city find the replacement trees in the vicinity of this project, since you're paying a fee for the difference between what you're not replanting, I think that would be a fair recommendation, to try to keep them in the vicinity of this project. 463 00:58:40.930 --> 00:58:45.809 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And can staff or the applicant comment on the spacing between the off-site trees currently? 464 00:58:53.640 --> 00:58:56.169 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): I'll give you a nominal number. 465 00:59:02.990 --> 00:59:07.259 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): So, existing… on Stevens Creek. 466 00:59:07.800 --> 00:59:12.520 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): The trees are… Say, 20 to 30 feet on center? 467 00:59:13.595 --> 00:59:14.474 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can you say that again? 468 00:59:15.035 --> 00:59:19.225 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): street trees on Stevens Creek are about 20 to 30 feet on center. 469 00:59:19.810 --> 00:59:21.629 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): On center. Spacing. 470 00:59:22.270 --> 00:59:26.630 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, so about 20 to 30 feet between these trees? Correct. 471 00:59:27.070 --> 00:59:29.790 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Does that love for more tree additions, or… 472 00:59:30.690 --> 00:59:42.339 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): Technically, yeah, but at a streetscape, 20 to 30 feet is a pretty common spacing. If you go tighter than that, yes, you can, but then you start to get a pretty dense canopy. 473 00:59:43.810 --> 00:59:47.770 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): And there's obviously more root competition, there's other… other complications of it as well. 474 00:59:48.630 --> 00:59:50.150 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, no more questions. 475 00:59:51.260 --> 00:59:59.370 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): So, I… I have a follow-up question again on the trees. So, I see there's 9 trees that are over 36 inches in diameter that are going to be removed. 476 00:59:59.490 --> 01:00:12.710 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Those are pretty significant sizes, and there's, I think, 69 that are between 18 and 36 inches, so also pretty big trees. And maybe this is a question for staff, I don't know, but 477 01:00:12.750 --> 01:00:19.729 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): is it possible to relocate some of these trees to somewhere else in the city? Or are we just, you know. 478 01:00:20.110 --> 01:00:23.030 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Limited in terms of what we can do with these trees. 479 01:00:24.120 --> 01:00:35.970 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): I mean, without speaking to a specific tree, a tree that large, would be pretty challenging to relocate. It would also be… it's species dependent. There's a lot of different factors that you would take into account. 480 01:00:37.120 --> 01:00:45.030 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): I would say, in general, it would be pretty challenging to relocate a tree that large, you know, in your 24 to 36 inch diameter. 481 01:00:46.920 --> 01:00:54.379 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): And the other kicker to that being, even if it is, say, a tree with high suitability to be relocated, there's still 482 01:00:54.630 --> 01:00:59.409 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): A decent chance that wherever that tree gets located, even with the best, 483 01:00:59.660 --> 01:01:04.279 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): Installation, all that, is there's a high chance the tree could snow die. 484 01:01:06.650 --> 01:01:07.490 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Commissioner Rao? 485 01:01:07.620 --> 01:01:12.779 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Question for staff. So, for the… Single family… 486 01:01:12.980 --> 01:01:15.720 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): What is… what is single-family versus townhome? 487 01:01:16.470 --> 01:01:22.970 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is that still considered R3, or is that… is the single-family portion treated differently than R3? 488 01:01:23.730 --> 01:01:30.560 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): The zoning for this site is P zoning, so it's PCG Res. This isn't R3 zoning. 489 01:01:30.930 --> 01:01:35.359 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, but in terms of the standards, we'd apply for single-family versus townhome? 490 01:01:36.890 --> 01:01:41.030 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Are there differences in what height would be allowed for single-family versus townhome? 491 01:01:42.760 --> 01:01:51.040 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I forget offhand, I think townhome is 30, 35 feet in the R3TH. Single family's typically 28. 492 01:01:51.570 --> 01:02:04.369 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think, obviously, this is a sort of a different typology for single-family. It looks, in a lot of ways, similar and compatible with the townhome development. It's a lot more vertical, you just don't share common walls. 493 01:02:04.750 --> 01:02:07.670 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): But the spacing is much tighter, 494 01:02:08.050 --> 01:02:17.309 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): You know, I think it's, in many ways, the layout, but for the adjoining walls, it's very similar to a townhome type of product. 495 01:02:19.290 --> 01:02:24.529 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is there technically a difference between a single family, in this case, and a detached townhome? 496 01:02:25.790 --> 01:02:26.779 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): There is such a thing. 497 01:02:26.940 --> 01:02:31.550 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I don't think there's a term for a detached townhome. It's probably a term you could… 498 01:02:31.700 --> 01:02:35.810 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Use that if you chose, but there's nothing defined that uses that language. 499 01:02:36.850 --> 01:02:41.170 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Separate question on the setbacks. The setback on Stevens Creek. 500 01:02:42.860 --> 01:02:50.240 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Did staff pursue any ways to maintain additional setback on the Stevens Creek side? I can understand the site setbacks. 501 01:02:50.530 --> 01:02:54.539 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Given the commercial neighbors on the western side. 502 01:02:55.100 --> 01:03:02.720 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And the fence on the eastern side with the driveway, there may be less of an impact from the side setback issue, but the front setback. 503 01:03:02.930 --> 01:03:05.699 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is that something that staff considered, whether they could… 504 01:03:06.080 --> 01:03:08.580 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): get additional setback on the Stevens Creek side? 505 01:03:09.640 --> 01:03:22.269 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): You know, I think the way the site's laid out with the roads and the configuration, it would be difficult, and I think it's just an exception of 3 feet… Yeah. Stevens Creek, so it's not a big deviation from what's required. 506 01:03:22.950 --> 01:03:27.520 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I guess we could say the same the other way around, say, why not give us back that 3 feet of setback? 507 01:03:28.880 --> 01:03:31.820 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Maybe a question for the applicant. Would you consider… 508 01:03:32.600 --> 01:03:37.360 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the additional 3 feet setback on Stevens Creek. It is an El Camino, after all. 509 01:03:41.990 --> 01:03:58.480 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Yeah, I can speak to this as well, and we can bring up the architect, but the challenge is with the spacing and the required setbacks in between the units, it's… I think it's impossible to, you know, to provide that additional setback without losing units or changing the unit typology. 510 01:03:59.980 --> 01:04:08.629 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So you don't have… additional… design options that would give us more setback on Stevens Creek? 511 01:04:10.570 --> 01:04:11.660 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): I don't believe so. 512 01:04:13.630 --> 01:04:17.140 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And there's no capability for staff to deny that waiver. 513 01:04:17.910 --> 01:04:27.039 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): it would be the same significant and negative impacts to the historic public health and safety. So those would be the same findings in order to deny the waiver. 514 01:04:27.720 --> 01:04:28.880 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Okay, thank you. 515 01:04:30.480 --> 01:04:32.559 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. Any other questions, Commissioner Linskog? 516 01:04:32.560 --> 01:04:47.429 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Yeah, sorry, one more. This is to the staff. So, in addition to what the developer is proposing, in terms of potentially, you know, some financial incentive to the retail to help them relocate. 517 01:04:47.430 --> 01:04:56.550 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Is there anything that the… that we can recommend as Planning Commission in terms of the Economic Development Manager or the City offering 518 01:04:56.710 --> 01:05:11.159 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): You know, rebate in permitting fees, or, you know, like, some sort of economic incentives that the city can offer to these retailers to help them resettle and encourage them to resettle somewhere else in the city? 519 01:05:11.520 --> 01:05:16.520 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think that would be a good idea. I don't know what particular incentive, but to convey that 520 01:05:16.860 --> 01:05:23.750 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): the city should be open to offering some kind of incentive to relocate, presumably within the city. Yeah, that would make sense. 521 01:05:24.930 --> 01:05:25.770 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Great, thank you. 522 01:05:27.360 --> 01:05:33.649 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): following on that. Is that something that would be conveyed within the motion, or separately? 523 01:05:35.020 --> 01:05:37.580 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think it could be conveyed in emotion, unless… 524 01:05:38.320 --> 01:05:40.619 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I get corrected by the attorney. 525 01:05:40.625 --> 01:05:51.685 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Yeah, no, I do believe that the city has made contact with the retail tenants, and that's a function of our economic development department, and, you know, we can convey to 526 01:05:52.205 --> 01:05:58.814 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): staff here, that when they make their presentation to Council to have a section on… on these issues. 527 01:05:59.705 --> 01:06:04.885 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): to be specific, I'd like to recommend not just that the economic development manager talk to them, but that the city 528 01:06:05.065 --> 01:06:22.645 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): economic, like, staff give concessions in terms of permitting fees, or, you know, like, employment tax, or whatever else we can come up with, but, like, look at giving some sort of financial incentives to the retailers to help them relocate somewhere else in the city. 529 01:06:22.645 --> 01:06:25.184 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): tangible financial incentive. Right, exactly. 530 01:06:25.190 --> 01:06:26.270 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Exactly. Thank you. 531 01:06:26.430 --> 01:06:27.400 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Commissioner Rao? 532 01:06:28.810 --> 01:06:32.280 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): What is the lease expiry for Panetta and Voyager? 533 01:06:36.440 --> 01:06:44.419 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): June of 2026 for Panera, and Voyager, I believe per the termination rate, is October of 2028. 534 01:06:45.870 --> 01:06:51.879 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And if they choose to exercise their right to stay till the end of lease, how does that… 535 01:06:52.290 --> 01:06:52.970 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): there's no… 536 01:06:52.975 --> 01:06:54.475 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Ability to do that per the lease. 537 01:06:54.475 --> 01:06:56.715 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So you have the right to terminate lease. That's correct. 538 01:06:56.715 --> 01:06:59.325 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): And it was contemplated in the original lease as well. 539 01:07:01.690 --> 01:07:08.360 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And have any recent tenant improvements been made by the tenants in the property, or… 540 01:07:09.280 --> 01:07:20.929 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): The most recent one that I'm aware of, was a drainage improvement that was made to the exterior, but I'm not… I can't speak to which improvements have been made to the interior. 541 01:07:21.090 --> 01:07:22.440 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Okay. Has the app. 542 01:07:22.445 --> 01:07:29.434 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Applicant pursued trying to relocate the tenant to the neighboring property that does have a vacant retail. 543 01:07:29.545 --> 01:07:30.635 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): They… they… 544 01:07:30.635 --> 01:07:45.245 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): already leased that corner, space? So the answer is yes. We talked to the adjacent property. They leased that corner space to a bank, but they have additional vacancies coming up, and there are other vacancies along Stevens Creek, and we've offered to 545 01:07:45.845 --> 01:07:52.705 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): make introductions to brokerages as well, to help them identify additional available space in Cupertino. Okay, thank you. 546 01:07:54.120 --> 01:08:01.659 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, I think at this point, we have a number of community members that have been patiently waiting, so let's move to public… That's right. Oh, I'm sorry, Commissioner Fung? 547 01:08:02.340 --> 01:08:06.559 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): So, I was actually just gonna ask in the, in the thread about, 548 01:08:06.700 --> 01:08:14.120 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): activities with economic development. Were there any similar adjustments with some of the other projects which displaced the… 549 01:08:15.930 --> 01:08:18.540 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): commercial sites, like Staples. 550 01:08:18.979 --> 01:08:22.539 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Like, in terms of having a condition, or a recommendation. 551 01:08:22.545 --> 01:08:26.294 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): having a, yeah, a consideration, maybe, is the… I don't think there was any. 552 01:08:26.444 --> 01:08:35.375 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): particular recommendation in the motion? Certainly, we've had members of the public speaking to loss of commercial and retail, but I don't recall anything where we had a 553 01:08:36.435 --> 01:08:41.505 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): a more specific motion to offer some kind of clear incentive. So there… 554 01:08:41.505 --> 01:08:49.234 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I mean, this is really a question for economic development, not for you, whether there were actions like that for other sites that have, 555 01:08:49.240 --> 01:08:58.740 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Right, and I do know economic development has been working with the tenants, so… but I just think the particular clear financial incentive, I don't remember 556 01:08:59.140 --> 01:09:02.120 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): That type of a specific recommendation. 557 01:09:03.859 --> 01:09:04.499 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Thank you. 558 01:09:05.560 --> 01:09:11.119 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, so we will move to public comments. City Clerk? We have two speakers in person. 559 01:09:11.125 --> 01:09:19.014 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): and two hands raised on Zoom. Our first speaker is Jennifer Griffin, followed by Asyn Demir Leoglu. Welcome, Jennifer. 560 01:09:20.510 --> 01:09:28.159 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Through the chat, if we may inform the public, if they're seated here and wish to speak, they can fill out a blue comment card and hand it to the clerk. 561 01:09:28.560 --> 01:09:29.990 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): At the front right. 562 01:09:31.529 --> 01:09:45.709 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Good evening, Planning Commission. This project looks nice. I think its only problem is that it's one of the seven SB330s that have whacked Cupertino in the last year. 563 01:09:45.919 --> 01:09:50.799 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I am really, really concerned about the loss of retail. 564 01:09:50.819 --> 01:10:02.589 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): With this project, we will have lost 700,000 square feet of retail in Cupertino on Stevens Creek Boulevard in the last year. That is unprecedented. 565 01:10:02.589 --> 01:10:12.029 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): 15 years ago, I sat through this project, when Panera and Voyager, and the previous one, I think it was Starbucks, 566 01:10:12.779 --> 01:10:19.409 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): were being… we went through painstakingly that frontage where Panera is. 567 01:10:20.059 --> 01:10:25.099 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): stall by stall, we went through the parking… 568 01:10:26.439 --> 01:10:35.649 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): access… the buildings on safe are the same age as Panera and Voyager. Their new retail for Cupertino. 569 01:10:35.809 --> 01:10:48.429 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I really, really am upset that I wasted… I obviously wasted my time 15 years ago to try to make this project be as viable as it is. 570 01:10:48.689 --> 01:10:52.849 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): Time can't be brought back. I lost a brother 10 years ago. 571 01:10:53.009 --> 01:10:59.889 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): to cancer. If I had that time that I sit on… I spent on city projects. 572 01:11:00.789 --> 01:11:03.529 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I would love to have spent it with my brother. 573 01:11:03.819 --> 01:11:06.659 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): But… This is what happens. 574 01:11:06.719 --> 01:11:23.409 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I feel that I put my time in, and we have viable retail there now. We have Voyager. We used to go to Good Earth, which was inside this complex. There is a reciprocal parking arrangement with whatever other property owners 575 01:11:23.409 --> 01:11:28.109 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I know I sat through it. My husband's eyeglass shop is on Seish. 576 01:11:28.189 --> 01:11:38.909 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): The target right now, the previous owner, when the target went up, they wanted to close Seiche and put in housing on the target property. 577 01:11:39.009 --> 01:11:43.019 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): We cannot close SACE anymore because there's no 578 01:11:43.209 --> 01:11:52.799 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): north and southwest fire access down Seiche. Target is up for sale. We could be… have more housing dumped on that property. 579 01:11:52.879 --> 01:12:05.479 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): And God knows what would happen to Bandley. I… I really… I think the project looks nice, I think they did a good job, but I really think that the city can do more. 580 01:12:05.479 --> 01:12:16.919 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): to retain retail. We have 7 of the stables that's across the street. SB330 is a bad bill. It's a retail killer. 581 01:12:16.939 --> 01:12:35.259 Speaker 1 (Community Hall): I watched it from 2019 and wondered what the heck Nancy Skinner was thinking. Now I know. We have one of these SB330 that's creeping up in the eastern side next to Cupertino High School. It's going to wipe out a bank, a daycare, and retail. Thank you. 582 01:12:36.460 --> 01:12:44.360 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Thank you, Jennifer. Our next speaker is Asin Dimir Leoglu, followed by Whit Turner, followed by Samir Shah. Welcome, Asin. 583 01:12:46.480 --> 01:12:52.659 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Good evening, City Council members. I'm Issinde Milo. I'm a long-time resident of Cupertino. 584 01:12:52.660 --> 01:12:59.730 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Having first lived in an unincorporated area, and later within the city limits after the annexation. 585 01:12:59.930 --> 01:13:09.930 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Nearly 38 years ago, my family and I moved from a graduate student housing to our current home, where we have remained ever since. 586 01:13:10.300 --> 01:13:27.439 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): In our earlier years, we lived in a residential graduate student community designed around the shared courtyards. These spaces provided a safe environment for children to play while fostering interaction among parents and neighbors. 587 01:13:27.900 --> 01:13:35.620 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Though modest in design, that community offered something invaluable, a strong sense of connection and belonging. 588 01:13:35.940 --> 01:13:43.130 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): For this reason, I appreciate many aspects of the proposed development. 589 01:13:43.250 --> 01:13:50.619 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Its layout appears To reflect elements that can support family life and neighborhood interaction. 590 01:13:50.780 --> 01:13:58.539 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): However, I'm concerned that an essential component of community building is being overlooked. 591 01:13:59.110 --> 01:14:07.440 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Accessible and informal gathering spaces, not only for the new community, but for the existing community at large. 592 01:14:07.840 --> 01:14:24.829 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): While I understand that including shared amenities such as clubhouses may increase HOA costs, I'm troubled by the loss of existing gathering places along Stevens Creek Boulevard, Panera Bread, and Voyager Cafe. 593 01:14:25.250 --> 01:14:30.880 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): As a reteere, I can attest that these cafes are more than commercial businesses. 594 01:14:30.990 --> 01:14:33.639 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): They are integral to daily life. 595 01:14:33.810 --> 01:14:43.629 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Places where residents meet regularly. Participate in organized groups, such as Cafe Italiano, and maintain social connections. 596 01:14:43.780 --> 01:14:53.280 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): They are places where people of all ages, young parents, seniors with walkers, neighbors with familiar faces, come together. 597 01:14:53.570 --> 01:14:57.499 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): They are places where you are greeted by name. 598 01:14:57.970 --> 01:15:11.740 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): From a planning perspective, the removal of such spaces represents more than a change in land use. It risks diminishing the social infrastructure that supports community well-being. 599 01:15:12.120 --> 01:15:25.790 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): For the city, losing these cafes may seem like a matter of revenue loss. For others, they may simply be places to buy coffee, but for many of us, they are essential part of our social fabric. 600 01:15:26.160 --> 01:15:33.880 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Taking them away means losing more than businesses. It means losing connection, routine, and community. 601 01:15:34.070 --> 01:15:51.349 Speaker 15 (Community Hall): Everything else around us that served as community gathering places are already gone. For current residents, this is a loss of daily life. For future residents, it's the loss of places where community begins. Thank you for your time. 602 01:15:51.355 --> 01:15:57.465 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): QSN. Our next speaker is Whit Turner, followed by Samir Shah, followed by Lauren Burrs. Welcome, Whit. 603 01:15:58.245 --> 01:16:01.234 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Good evening, Commissioners. Thank you for having us. 604 01:16:01.240 --> 01:16:12.750 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): With Turner, on behalf of the Housing Action Coalition, we're a member-supported nonprofit, works to build more housing at all income levels in order to alleviate the state's housing crisis. Cupertino, super rich in jobs. 605 01:16:12.755 --> 01:16:24.434 Speaker 16 (Community Hall): Higher Opportunity City, this is a place where affordable homeownership is out of reach for a lot of the families who work here. And this project is a common sense solution to that, and the housing shortage in California as a whole. 606 01:16:24.435 --> 01:16:38.405 Speaker 16 (Community Hall): Transforming underutilized aging office space into townhomes, addressing the desperate need for family-sized housing with 3 and 4 bedrooms. And beyond the density, it's a smart transition for the site, replacing the office space, seeing a decrease in traffic. 607 01:16:38.405 --> 01:16:50.554 Speaker 16 (Community Hall): preserving trees and providing open space. Our project review committee endorsed this proposal because it goes above and beyond our standards for family-oriented housing. I want to commend the Harvest Properties team. 608 01:16:50.555 --> 01:17:00.645 Speaker 16 (Community Hall): For their work on this. They've done a great job, and we urge the Commission to move this forward immediately. Cupertino needs to keep its housing pipeline moving, and this project is ready to go. Thank you. 609 01:17:06.080 --> 01:17:12.429 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Thank you, Whit. Our next speaker is Samir Shah, followed by Lauren Burris, followed by Patrick Bum. Welcome, Samir. 610 01:17:13.380 --> 01:17:22.589 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Thank you. I… we weren't quite sure how this goes, so I think Lauren's gonna speak on our behalf. We turned in two cards, but I think she'll… she'll do the talking. Okay. 611 01:17:23.520 --> 01:17:29.139 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Thank you so much for holding this committee hearing, and I want to say that. 612 01:17:29.690 --> 01:17:44.659 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): our landlord has reached out to us, and they have made, hopefully things as easy for us as possible moving forward. We have not heard from the city. We've heard from nobody, who has told us anything. 613 01:17:44.750 --> 01:17:56.170 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): Until we found out from our landlord. And, I wanted to correct, what I heard when I… when I heard that, we had been reached out to. 614 01:17:56.630 --> 01:18:02.539 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): Just to let you guys know, we're a… we're a small business that… 615 01:18:02.690 --> 01:18:11.579 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): almost, almost died out with COVID. This, this, this place, this, beautiful. 616 01:18:12.280 --> 01:18:15.180 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): beautiful cafe that we built. 617 01:18:15.440 --> 01:18:19.719 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): it was our way to come out of COVID and have some hope again. And… 618 01:18:20.910 --> 01:18:27.629 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): it's… it's killing us. You know, we're gonna do everything we can, and we hope that we will get help from 619 01:18:27.840 --> 01:18:29.859 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): Other people to get there, but… 620 01:18:30.010 --> 01:18:38.119 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): we're self-funded. We spent the last of our money on this build-out. And now our biggest location is gone. 621 01:18:38.640 --> 01:18:41.510 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): in the next 12 to 18 months, and I just want… 622 01:18:41.870 --> 01:18:48.239 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): us to be able to at least be able to say that this is really hard for us, and we want to stay in Cupertino. 623 01:18:48.390 --> 01:19:06.230 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): And we'll do everything we can. But anything that the city can do, anything that, any concessions you can make, any help to go to our next place and have our permitting fees waived, anything, it's gonna help, and we would really, really ask for that from the bottom of our hearts. 624 01:19:06.930 --> 01:19:07.930 Speaker 17 (Community Hall): Thank you. 625 01:19:09.220 --> 01:19:13.849 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Thank you, Lauren. Our next speaker is Patrick Bum, followed by David. Welcome, Patrick. 626 01:19:25.850 --> 01:19:27.460 Patrick Bumb: Okay, can you hear me? 627 01:19:28.270 --> 01:19:29.640 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Yes, we can hear you. 628 01:19:29.640 --> 01:19:45.309 Patrick Bumb: Okay. Good evening, Chair, Vice Chair, and Commissioners. My name is Patrick Bum with Borelli Investment Company. I'm speaking on behalf of our client, Saishway LLC. They're the property owner for the retail project adjacent to the subject property. 629 01:19:45.460 --> 01:19:53.970 Patrick Bumb: Our client respectfully requests that the Commission continue the item, to a future date, rather than taking action tonight. 630 01:19:53.990 --> 01:20:07.530 Patrick Bumb: This will allow the parties additional time to coordinate and address some outstanding issues in a thoughtful and productive manner. Our client was made aware of the proposed development approximately 48 hours ago. 631 01:20:07.530 --> 01:20:23.400 Patrick Bumb: And they have not had sufficient time to fully evaluate the potential impacts. Given the shared infrastructure and interrelated considerations between the properties, we feel that additional time is warranted to ensure a well-coordinated outcome. 632 01:20:24.010 --> 01:20:38.460 Patrick Bumb: Additionally, the existing reciprocal easement agreement reflects extensive coordination between the parties in the City of Cupertino, particularly with respect to traffic circulation and shared site improvements. 633 01:20:38.770 --> 01:20:56.899 Patrick Bumb: The requirement for the City Manager to approve, a modification to the easement agreement under Section 23 further underscores that these matters extend beyond just private agreements and are integral to the City's original project approvals. 634 01:20:57.040 --> 01:21:12.849 Patrick Bumb: Accordingly, we respectfully request that the considerations outlined in the letter that was sent to the Planning Commission today at 2.40 p.m. be carefully evaluated and incorporated into any project conditions of approval. 635 01:21:12.880 --> 01:21:20.369 Patrick Bumb: With that being said, thank you for your time, and I remain available for any questions that you may have. 636 01:21:22.560 --> 01:21:25.860 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Thank you, Patrick. Our next speaker is David. Welcome, David. 637 01:21:30.930 --> 01:21:32.330 David: Hi there, can you hear me? 638 01:21:33.050 --> 01:21:34.350 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Yes, we can hear you. 639 01:21:34.350 --> 01:21:45.069 David: Okay, thank you. Chair Solcheron, Vice Chair Scharf, Planning Commission, thank you so much for this opportunity to speak this evening. We really appreciate it. 640 01:21:45.070 --> 01:21:56.499 David: I'm calling in asking the Planning Commission to oppose this development project, mostly because it will eliminate one of the true, thriving hearts of this community in Voyager and Panera. 641 01:21:56.510 --> 01:22:14.220 David: I want to make the key point that this project is not like the 6 other SB330 projects in Cupertino. Again, this project is not like the other, SB330 projects in the city, and the reason for that is it's eliminating active, thriving retail. 642 01:22:14.220 --> 01:22:17.779 David: This project eliminates a real community hub. 643 01:22:17.980 --> 01:22:29.160 David: If you spend, any time around Voyager, you know the line often stretches out the door. If you come on a holiday or a weekend, it stretches around the building. This place is beloved. 644 01:22:29.160 --> 01:22:40.200 David: For a city like Cupertino that is rapidly losing its retail, its small businesses, and its vibrancy, it seems highly foolish to approve a project that eliminates 645 01:22:40.200 --> 01:22:51.170 David: A highly vibrant, highly successful, highly beloved small business, especially when this project offers zero replacement retail for the community as a whole. 646 01:22:51.440 --> 01:23:03.259 David: I actually think the term retail here is a misnomer. We should be using the term community, because Voyager and Panera are very different from a store where you just walk in, buy some essential items, and leave. 647 01:23:03.260 --> 01:23:14.489 David: Voyager and Panera are active, thriving communities. Do a search for any kind of meetup in Cupertino. Doesn't matter if it's political activism, startups, a knitting club, a book club. 648 01:23:14.490 --> 01:23:32.279 David: they take place in this complex, and that's what's being destroyed here. I would wager to say that more community takes place week by week in Voyager and Panera than does in Quinlan Center. And really, the issue at hand here is the Cupertino community, not… 649 01:23:32.420 --> 01:23:34.879 David: Two random cafes, or just retail. 650 01:23:35.060 --> 01:23:54.739 David: This especially affects seniors, young people, and students. Cupertino offers very little in the way of third spaces for seniors, young people, and students to gather. This project, you know, eliminates vital community space for people who can't easily invite others into their homes. 651 01:23:56.110 --> 01:24:14.409 David: As you heard earlier, the owners of Voyager poured their time and energy and money, completely into renovating the space. Their loss is profound, and I'm not sure that the Planning Commission or the City Council understands just how profound that loss is. 652 01:24:14.410 --> 01:24:35.959 David: For the owners of Voyager and for the community as a whole. They offered the city so much with everything they've given us these many years, and it seems in return, the city is just sending bulldozers to tear down their business. This really needs to be rectified. It's a loss for Cupertino and for these owners. It's a tremendous injustice. 653 01:24:35.960 --> 01:24:37.489 David: Thank you for listening. 654 01:24:38.460 --> 01:24:42.729 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Thank you, David. We have no speaker cards in person, and no hands raised on Zoom, Chair. 655 01:24:43.580 --> 01:24:48.320 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you very much. So, we'll now bring this back to the Commission. Do we have any questions 656 01:24:48.970 --> 01:24:56.399 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Or we actually, I apologize, the applicant also has an opportunity to respond to the comments. 657 01:24:58.660 --> 01:25:09.730 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Just wanted to respond with regards to the adjacent Sageway retail. We do have a private REA in place that we, coordinated with them when they were developing their property. 658 01:25:09.730 --> 01:25:21.969 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Our plans respect that easement. There's no change to the REA, that is needed. We still have the same maintenance rights. They would like to change it so that we no longer have 659 01:25:22.020 --> 01:25:32.499 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): use of the trash receptacles, which we're open to, and we have said that we are open to, but if you look on the plans, there is no impact to the REA whatsoever. 660 01:25:32.630 --> 01:25:36.599 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): It's still maintained in the exact same way that the city approved originally. 661 01:25:39.450 --> 01:25:41.330 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you. Any… Commissioner Rouse? 662 01:25:41.635 --> 01:25:46.285 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, while the applicant's up at the podium, maybe you can stay at the podium, we have questions for you. 663 01:25:46.915 --> 01:25:53.174 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So, and I don't know if staff can project the letter we received from the, from Mr. Blum, I believe. 664 01:25:53.975 --> 01:25:55.195 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can we project that? 665 01:25:55.365 --> 01:25:56.274 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I don't have the ability. 666 01:25:56.280 --> 01:25:57.330 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): to do that. 667 01:25:57.650 --> 01:25:58.580 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I don't have it. 668 01:25:58.580 --> 01:26:00.570 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can the city clerk project the letter? 669 01:26:01.630 --> 01:26:03.879 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): Let me see if I can do it. Thank you. 670 01:26:07.390 --> 01:26:15.320 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And so, while the applicant's up here, if you make comment on the letter that I presume you have read, and 671 01:26:15.600 --> 01:26:20.150 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Firstly, the shared roadway. Can you comment on what portion of the roadway 672 01:26:20.540 --> 01:26:24.329 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is split, as far as your lot line is concerned, and… 673 01:26:24.690 --> 01:26:31.169 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And we will call on the member of the public to clarify on their behalf as well. I think we have the… 674 01:26:31.550 --> 01:26:36.030 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The City Attney, can you clarify if we may call on the member of the public to comment? 675 01:26:36.300 --> 01:26:37.250 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): As needed. 676 01:26:42.480 --> 01:26:45.030 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): I just wanted to mention, Commissioner, that, 677 01:26:45.340 --> 01:26:58.099 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): I mean, these are important issues, you know, and it involves the site, and so, you know, I think it's appropriate to entertain some discussion. But, keep in mind, this is, you know, a… a… 678 01:26:58.520 --> 01:27:12.549 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): discussion between these adjoining private van owners, and so I'm not sure how germane it is to the specific issues really before us, in terms of their development application. 679 01:27:12.555 --> 01:27:18.934 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): If I may clarify why this is germane, I think the benefit of hindsight with Westport is showing us that had we 680 01:27:19.375 --> 01:27:23.904 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): appropriately quantified the responsibilities of that shared driveway in Westport. 681 01:27:24.705 --> 01:27:37.124 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): we would not have seen the amount of rest and pushback that we have had, and the city's involvement from transportation and public works to put in signage and various other requests that have come our way. And so, I would… I would… 682 01:27:37.495 --> 01:27:40.654 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I would beg to defer that that shared driveway is still… 683 01:27:40.805 --> 01:27:49.334 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): an area that needs some level of clarification, maybe from the applicant. If you might comment on what areas you guys agree on, and 684 01:27:49.565 --> 01:27:51.785 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And just sort of help us find where… 685 01:27:51.965 --> 01:27:53.975 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): There may be anything here to tease apart. 686 01:27:55.110 --> 01:28:07.349 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): So if you, access the civil drawings, you can look at this tentative map there. There's a parcel H that's listed, I believe, that is all of the driveway land area that we own. 687 01:28:07.355 --> 01:28:08.744 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): wanna put it up there, or… 688 01:28:09.230 --> 01:28:11.909 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I don't think… this was not part of our presentation, so… 689 01:28:12.110 --> 01:28:17.220 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I don't have a way to pull this one up specifically. I guess if you pull up the site plan, let's go… 690 01:28:17.225 --> 01:28:19.475 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): If you have a hard copy, you can just put it on there. 691 01:28:23.225 --> 01:28:23.895 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Clark? 692 01:28:28.830 --> 01:28:29.370 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Can that work? 693 01:28:30.070 --> 01:28:32.090 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): How do I… Yep. 694 01:28:32.350 --> 01:28:35.059 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Can you see this? Yep. Oh, that's kind of cool. 695 01:28:35.375 --> 01:28:49.605 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): So Parcel H, so just to orient you, you have Stevens Creek Boulevard right here. Apologies, my finger… thank you. You have Stevens Creek Boulevard right here. Here's the main entrance to the overall site. These parcels reflect the different townhomes that we have. 696 01:28:50.145 --> 01:28:55.195 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Parcel H is the component of the shared driveway that we own. 697 01:28:55.645 --> 01:29:13.804 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): And you will see, if you then were to overlay this with our architectural plans or our landscape plans, we are proposing to preserve that component of the shared driveway so that the Sageway retail, you know, facing SACE, maintains all of the access, that they currently have today. 698 01:29:18.430 --> 01:29:22.629 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): There is no change to the driveway, just to reiterate it. 699 01:29:23.390 --> 01:29:28.770 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): And there's no change to any portion of the easement that has been agreed to. What documents. 700 01:29:28.775 --> 01:29:33.435 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): They exist that govern the obligations of each parcel owner on the driveway? 701 01:29:33.715 --> 01:29:34.494 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That is… 702 01:29:34.500 --> 01:29:37.530 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): the REA, that was referenced. 703 01:29:37.535 --> 01:29:38.284 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Can you expand our region? 704 01:29:38.585 --> 01:29:39.715 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): What is RDA? 705 01:29:39.715 --> 01:29:59.524 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): reciprocal easement agreement, so it was an agreement that Blair and the Borelli family negotiated back in 2014, that contemplated the idea that there was a shared driveway, and that there was some shared trash receptacles area, and the access going back and forth. So we provided access to them on our portion. 706 01:29:59.525 --> 01:30:00.944 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Of the shared driveway? 707 01:30:01.015 --> 01:30:08.394 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): They provided access to us on their portion of the shared driveway, and then also provided access to us for the retail trash. 708 01:30:09.020 --> 01:30:17.310 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, so in the scenario currently where you have retail, and both parties here have retail, any… 709 01:30:18.030 --> 01:30:22.839 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): usage of the shared driveway by the public that may result in potential 710 01:30:23.090 --> 01:30:26.200 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Accidental injury that results in litigation. 711 01:30:26.420 --> 01:30:27.779 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is treated how? 712 01:30:33.490 --> 01:30:42.220 Speaker 13 (Community Hall): I don't… I'm sorry, I'm counsel for the applicant here. I don't believe these are germane to Planning Commission questions as far as the liabilities between two private parties in a contract. 713 01:30:42.220 --> 01:30:45.580 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): I just think we're digressing from the application before you. 714 01:30:45.585 --> 01:30:50.975 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The context for the question is, once the fence is erected for the development. 715 01:30:51.165 --> 01:30:55.055 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The fence would be to the west of this shared driveway. 716 01:30:55.315 --> 01:30:58.325 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And a portion of that shared driveway remains. 717 01:30:58.725 --> 01:31:03.815 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the lot of the parcel, so is the HOA gonna be… 718 01:31:04.355 --> 01:31:11.705 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Liable for any injuries or accidental impact to members of the public using the shared driveway? 719 01:31:12.540 --> 01:31:19.229 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): That will be determined through the contract and through, civil litigation. I don't think we need to worry about that in the Planning Commission hearing tonight. 720 01:31:20.600 --> 01:31:27.280 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): I mean, it's… the liabilities for an accident in the future, based off a contract, I don't think is what we should be talking about tonight. 721 01:31:27.990 --> 01:31:30.519 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): I mean, we could go through it, there are maintenance obligations in the REA. 722 01:31:30.700 --> 01:31:32.820 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): But I don't think this part… 723 01:31:33.110 --> 01:31:38.840 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): The purpose of this hearing is not to go through this contract. The applicant is working with the neighboring owner. 724 01:31:39.040 --> 01:31:45.069 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): And is entertaining changes to the REA to address their concerns, but they aren't obligated to. 725 01:31:45.070 --> 01:31:52.920 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Does the applicant understand that there have been significant issues involving shared driveways in a neighboring site, which was formerly the Oaks? So, I… 726 01:31:52.920 --> 01:32:07.789 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): I apologize, but, Chair, we are going pretty far afield. It is not agendized for this wide-ranging concerns. There are legitimate concerns. I respect that. Commissioner Riley's really good questions. They're just not agendized for discussion. 727 01:32:07.790 --> 01:32:27.290 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): tonight here, you know, I mean, if there was issues with the REA, liability, use of driveways, if those type of issues were germane for this particular development application, then the Brown Act would require that, you know, that be part of the agenda to this… for this discussion, and it is not. 728 01:32:27.290 --> 01:32:31.229 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): point of inquiry to the city at me. These could be potential conditions of approval. 729 01:32:31.400 --> 01:32:32.440 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, this… 730 01:32:32.440 --> 01:32:50.529 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): these, you know, the… I think the relationship between these private parties who executed this… this easement agreement 12 years ago, it's… it's… I don't… I would imagine and expect that staff would have incorporated these into the conditions approval if they thought it was germane to this application. 731 01:32:51.015 --> 01:32:54.945 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): But what I heard from staff is outreach is expected. 732 01:32:55.175 --> 01:33:00.384 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): From whom? I did not… I believe the outreach is expected from the… 733 01:33:01.375 --> 01:33:04.815 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): People that were noticed, in this case, the neighboring retail. 734 01:33:05.570 --> 01:33:15.860 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): And we did notice them. The property was sold from the prior ownership that we negotiated with, and so we noticed the new ownership as part of our community outreach, and we never heard back until 735 01:33:16.200 --> 01:33:17.190 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): What, 24 hours. 736 01:33:17.195 --> 01:33:21.485 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And so this hearing is their opportunity to come back to us, and that's what they have done. 737 01:33:22.140 --> 01:33:34.660 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): The one thing that I will address is that's all outlined in the existing REA, and unless we amend the REA, it would be handled exactly the same way as it is right now with the retail properties. 738 01:33:34.665 --> 01:33:38.214 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is it fair to say, just a closing question on this topic, that 739 01:33:39.085 --> 01:33:41.755 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): You believe you have agreement with them. 740 01:33:42.385 --> 01:33:50.264 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): On surrendering the use of the trash area, and then the modifications to allow for 741 01:33:50.645 --> 01:33:57.344 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the shared driveway to be used by the other party. So, if you can comment on the ask 1 and ask 3, I think… 742 01:33:57.565 --> 01:33:59.374 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): In that letter. We do have. 743 01:33:59.380 --> 01:34:00.060 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): a. 744 01:34:00.065 --> 01:34:06.624 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): private easement agreement with them, the REA as we've been referring to it, that does address both of those. That is correct. 745 01:34:06.625 --> 01:34:10.824 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And would you comment on number 2, which seems out of the scope of your property? 746 01:34:10.925 --> 01:34:12.594 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): They're… they're asked number two. 747 01:34:13.985 --> 01:34:14.885 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The cold cuts. 748 01:34:14.885 --> 01:34:15.805 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Yes. 749 01:34:15.810 --> 01:34:28.989 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): At this point, we are not open to a lot line adjustment. I don't know why they want our land without compensation, but we are open to amending the REA, as we told them, if there's interest. 750 01:34:29.170 --> 01:34:30.369 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Okay, thank you. 751 01:34:32.090 --> 01:34:33.009 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Yes, it is. 752 01:34:33.800 --> 01:34:35.730 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): I'm done. If he's done, I'm done. 753 01:34:36.950 --> 01:34:39.430 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Okay, I have one question. Yes. 754 01:34:39.860 --> 01:34:59.279 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Hi, sorry. So the… the driveway that cuts across from Alves to Stevens Creek, right, the main driveway, we've… we've had issues with similar developments where, neighbors use that as a… as a cut-through, and, generating 755 01:34:59.280 --> 01:35:03.130 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): You know, complaints from the residents, in that development. 756 01:35:03.130 --> 01:35:09.269 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Have you guys considered that? Have you put in any, any kind of, you know. 757 01:35:09.270 --> 01:35:15.799 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): measures in place to protect the residents from a lot of traffic coming through? Yeah, so I think. 758 01:35:15.800 --> 01:35:18.030 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): I think the… the best… 759 01:35:18.080 --> 01:35:33.669 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): choice for this was how we designed it. So we intentionally chose, at one point, let me step back a sec, we at one point thought about an idea where you had almost a direct connection that was almost straight from Al's to Stevens Creek Boulevard. 760 01:35:33.680 --> 01:35:49.699 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): After discussions internally with the team and thinking about the issues of cross-traffic, we intentionally chose to have that road meander all the way through the site to, frankly, make it very inefficient for someone who wants to be a cut-through traffic individual. 761 01:35:49.740 --> 01:35:54.350 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): And so that was our solution to that potential issue. 762 01:35:57.300 --> 01:36:00.709 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Staff, based on your experience… 763 01:36:01.080 --> 01:36:12.980 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): what happened with Westport, would you recommend anything more, like signs, or, you know, because I know we just had this conversation about, you know, how to minimize traffic, because 764 01:36:13.310 --> 01:36:19.759 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): that's not gonna stop them, in my experience. So, yeah, I would be interested in staff recommendations. 765 01:36:21.440 --> 01:36:31.559 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Yeah, I think this is a different… the design layout's quite a bit different, though, too, that this is not that sort of straight shot that we're looking at at Westport, where… 766 01:36:32.120 --> 01:36:39.889 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): In that case, Mary Avenue sort of meanders and takes you further before you come back to Stevens Creek to make your right turn. 767 01:36:40.390 --> 01:36:43.760 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): there you have a straight road that you can see Stevens Creek and 768 01:36:43.900 --> 01:36:49.150 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think it's… even with speed bumps, it makes sense for people that want to cut through to go that way. 769 01:36:49.800 --> 01:36:51.699 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Here, when I look at the site. 770 01:36:52.570 --> 01:36:56.340 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): you're sort of looking from Elvis South, you're gonna see buildings. 771 01:36:57.030 --> 01:37:00.449 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): And then you have a road that's gonna swing all the way to the west, so… 772 01:37:00.850 --> 01:37:03.119 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I think the layout is… 773 01:37:03.480 --> 01:37:07.719 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): People are looking to cut through, they're looking for efficiency. This is not efficient for cutting through. 774 01:37:10.870 --> 01:37:24.670 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I have one question for the applicant. I, you know, I think you've heard a lot of concern from the community around the loss of retail, and I know that you did consider alternative designs that would have kept the retail. Could you speak a little bit more to why those did not end up working out? 775 01:37:25.570 --> 01:37:44.360 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Sure. So, as I mentioned in the presentation, March to July of last year, we did some extensive, kind of, alternate design options that would have preserved the retail along, Stevens Creek Boulevard. And we got… we worked on that with staff. Ultimately, after 776 01:37:44.620 --> 01:37:55.660 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Coming up with that solution, we were advised by staff that, unfortunately, that modification to our application wouldn't be permissible under SB330. 777 01:37:55.680 --> 01:38:09.549 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): And we would have to resubmit the application. This was 12 to 18 months into the process already, so we would have been looking at, at minimum, a 1-2 year kind of overall extension to the project. And in addition to that. 778 01:38:09.550 --> 01:38:21.539 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): Since we had submitted in April 1st of 24, the housing element had come in, so a higher density requirement would have been hitting on the other side of the project as well. 779 01:38:21.540 --> 01:38:35.279 Speaker 10 (Community Hall): So, when we originally looked at this, it was a potential loss of 16 units. With the advisement that we would have to resubmit the application, we were looking at a minimum of 32 to 40 units, going away from the project based on that. 780 01:38:37.030 --> 01:38:40.210 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Great, thank you so much. Do we have any other questions for the applicant? 781 01:38:41.580 --> 01:38:43.390 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yes. Yes. 782 01:38:45.210 --> 01:38:45.940 Community Hall: So… 783 01:38:47.820 --> 01:38:55.289 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Questions regarding the site setback, I believe we have reduced that, as proposed, quite significantly. 784 01:38:56.690 --> 01:39:04.869 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): How is fire accepting the reduced setback? Do they have the ability to get ladders up to the roof of the building at 50 feet? 785 01:39:09.010 --> 01:39:22.930 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So, the fire department did, approve their plans with conditions, so the project will be required to comply with fire code, but they did give an approval of the project. 786 01:39:24.430 --> 01:39:26.040 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): What were those conditions? 787 01:39:27.110 --> 01:39:38.939 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So there are several conditions. They are included in the resolutions, particularly for the architectural and site approval. They do pertain to the ground letter access. 788 01:39:39.060 --> 01:39:44.670 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): Aerial access, and then the fire lanes, parking, fire hydrants, fire flow, etc. 789 01:39:47.350 --> 01:39:49.639 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And so, point of inquiry is this… 790 01:39:50.170 --> 01:39:55.879 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): hearing allowed to ask questions about fire, or is that out of the scope of the planning hearing? 791 01:39:57.220 --> 01:40:00.050 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Question to either staff or the city attorney. 792 01:40:00.410 --> 01:40:08.919 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): We can assist with very general questions, but we are not representative of the fire department, and there are no representatives of the fire department here tonight. So, are the fire… 793 01:40:10.400 --> 01:40:17.489 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So, is this going to be ground ladder access, or is it aerial apparatus access, in the case of a 50 feet construction? 794 01:40:17.760 --> 01:40:20.800 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): There will be both aerial access and ground letter access. 795 01:40:21.100 --> 01:40:22.130 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): But the project was reviewed. 796 01:40:22.135 --> 01:40:25.345 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Considering which… Approach. Both. 797 01:40:29.135 --> 01:40:30.095 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay. 798 01:40:31.850 --> 01:40:32.449 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Thank you. 799 01:40:34.390 --> 01:40:37.310 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Any other questions for the applicant? 800 01:40:37.715 --> 01:40:38.845 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Can we… 801 01:40:38.845 --> 01:40:43.415 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Before we close the hearing, can we invite the… 802 01:40:43.675 --> 01:40:47.175 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Neighboring retail, if he wishes to respond to what he has heard so far. 803 01:40:48.555 --> 01:40:49.934 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The member of the public? 804 01:40:50.165 --> 01:40:51.495 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): If they're still present. 805 01:40:52.345 --> 01:40:56.165 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can we unmute the member of the public that represents the retail to the east? 806 01:40:56.385 --> 01:40:57.945 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): To allow them to comment. 807 01:41:00.280 --> 01:41:01.690 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): City attorneys… 808 01:41:01.690 --> 01:41:02.290 Patrick Bumb: Hear me? 809 01:41:02.290 --> 01:41:02.820 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay. 810 01:41:07.490 --> 01:41:12.749 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Sorry, to clarify, City Attorney, is there a duration of time that we should all… this is sort of… 811 01:41:14.160 --> 01:41:19.680 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Yeah, we normally don't provide Second opportunities like this, then… 812 01:41:20.030 --> 01:41:24.910 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Then other speakers might want to… Also had that opportunity. 813 01:41:27.250 --> 01:41:34.429 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yes, I… yeah, I, you know, I think this is a somewhat of a deviation from our typical practice. 814 01:41:34.965 --> 01:41:39.274 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We have a potential condition of approval involving a shared driveway. 815 01:41:39.625 --> 01:41:41.775 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I'd like to hear from the… 816 01:41:42.645 --> 01:41:48.715 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Person sharing the driveway on whether they would be open to our conditions of approval, potentially, that they're requesting. 817 01:41:49.730 --> 01:41:54.379 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Use of the shared drive is actually another condition approval, and it's not part of today's item. 818 01:41:55.060 --> 01:42:09.640 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Yeah, I think this… this has been discussed and answered. If they have any other comments, I think they're gonna discuss privately, and then it'll come to the City Council, so I think as far as the Planning Commission has done, is on this topic, I think we've discussed it extensively. 819 01:42:09.645 --> 01:42:15.494 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We have, through the Chair, we have had previous hearings where we've allowed members of the public who were in the room to come up and comment. 820 01:42:15.905 --> 01:42:26.145 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We've had dividend homes hearing where members of the public came up and responded to comments. I think it's only fair to the neighboring retail that we allow them to comment, similar to what we've done in other hearings. 821 01:42:26.145 --> 01:42:42.795 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Those were comments made by the public that were directly impacted by the neighbors and their project, and they had comments germane to this, not for this private discussion. I'm a little bit hesitant to get involved in, you know, this commercial discussion between two private entities. 822 01:42:43.320 --> 01:42:46.110 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): It's the discretion of the chair, whether you wish to support that or not. 823 01:42:48.480 --> 01:43:03.570 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I think we've been told that that is not particularly relevant to the hearing that is at hand tonight, and so I'm reluctant to allow dedicated time to a member of the public on a topic that we are not approving at the moment. 824 01:43:06.510 --> 01:43:09.190 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Are we ready to make a motion? 825 01:43:09.190 --> 01:43:12.620 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): So, with that, if there are no further questions for the applicant… 826 01:43:14.230 --> 01:43:19.279 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): then we will close the public hearing. And yes, bring it back to the Commission for comments. 827 01:43:20.580 --> 01:43:36.170 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): So, for the sake of getting us started, I'd like to make a motion, to approve the project as written, with the addition of, requiring the city to provide, significant tangible financial benefits to the retail, 828 01:43:36.280 --> 01:43:41.750 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): establishments to allow them to relocate within Cupertino somewhere else. 829 01:43:44.690 --> 01:43:54.470 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I would like to make a friendly amendment to… I don't know, I mean, staff can correct me if they think this is maybe too specific, but, in terms of… 830 01:43:54.750 --> 01:43:55.830 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): city… 831 01:43:55.970 --> 01:44:11.910 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): assistance of the relocation, that staff consider expedited permitting and potential fee waivers where possible to assist Voyager, as well as an evaluation of the fees that 832 01:44:11.940 --> 01:44:18.109 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): The businesses would be paying, and to see where there might be any opportunity to assist. 833 01:44:18.880 --> 01:44:38.139 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Yeah, I mean, that's fine, as long as those are not the only things they consider, but they cast a wider net in terms of, you know, can the Arts Commission help, provide some, you know, art help? Can the city, you know, expedite permits, or waive permitting fees, or, you know, pretty much anything else we can provide as a city to help them across all of our, 834 01:44:38.140 --> 01:44:40.270 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Departments and commissions. 835 01:44:41.120 --> 01:44:56.489 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): So, just so that everyone's clear, so the record's clear, perhaps I want to ask the mover, the original mover, Commissioner Linskop, for you, to the extent that you heard the chair's suggestions for you to start in motion afresh, and then obtain the second. 836 01:44:57.290 --> 01:44:57.830 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Okay. 837 01:44:57.970 --> 01:45:04.580 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Alright, I move for, for us to accept the recommended action, 838 01:45:04.760 --> 01:45:13.960 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): And an addition… an additional, amendment that the city, provides significant tangible financial benefits to 839 01:45:14.230 --> 01:45:31.319 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): The retail establishments that are getting dislocated, including, looking at fee-expedited, approvals, fee, reduces… reductions, and pretty much anything else that the city can provide through its, 840 01:45:31.660 --> 01:45:33.720 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Different departments and commissions. 841 01:45:33.880 --> 01:45:35.369 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Does that cover everything? 842 01:45:35.650 --> 01:45:40.009 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Well, let's get a second on that, and then if there's a friendly amendment, then someone else can… 843 01:45:40.200 --> 01:45:41.920 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): Ask for a friendly amendment. 844 01:45:41.920 --> 01:45:44.259 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I'll second that for the purpose of discussion. 845 01:45:44.420 --> 01:45:51.180 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I think that, you know, just my comment here would be that, Yeah, I love Voyager, too. 846 01:45:51.360 --> 01:45:58.810 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): This… this… situation does arise, I hope that, you know, that there would be a uniform. 847 01:45:59.090 --> 01:46:06.160 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): application here, that, you know, we're not saying we love this business and we don't love this other one. But… 848 01:46:06.750 --> 01:46:13.910 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I'd certainly, I certainly would agree that, and I think that I would say this for any, any business that's being dislocated. 849 01:46:14.110 --> 01:46:21.819 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): the city… I would encourage the economic development group to consider exactly the kinds of things, fee waivers. 850 01:46:21.960 --> 01:46:26.719 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And, and, expedited permitting to allow them to stay. 851 01:46:29.400 --> 01:46:36.470 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Yeah, if I can just comment quickly on that, no, I agree. I think it's a slippery slope, right? It's like, who do we support, who do we not? 852 01:46:36.590 --> 01:46:49.609 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): it's tricky, I 100% get it, but I think in this case, they are very much part of the social fabric of our community. They are an important part of the social fabric of our community. I think as many speakers have mentioned. 853 01:46:49.850 --> 01:47:03.009 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): They're always packed. They're a meeting area for our children, for our seniors, for, you know, so many of our community members. So, anything we can do as a city to help them. 854 01:47:03.430 --> 01:47:10.679 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): land on their feet and find another place within the city where they can thrive, I think it is our responsibility to do that. 855 01:47:12.670 --> 01:47:13.820 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): through the chair. 856 01:47:14.110 --> 01:47:20.829 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I don't know where this stops. If we start to give subsidies from the city, You have Panera. 857 01:47:20.970 --> 01:47:22.920 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): You have the retail that… 858 01:47:23.590 --> 01:47:31.650 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): is lost at Staples, at United Furniture, and so on. I would actually wonder why we wouldn't motion this to require 859 01:47:32.850 --> 01:47:34.660 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): or encourage… 860 01:47:35.160 --> 01:47:49.449 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): any lease termination to go towards tenant improvement for a future location. It's not like Cupertino does not have retail space. We have plenty of retail space. We have 2,000 square feet at the Westport that is sitting as a shell. 861 01:47:50.310 --> 01:47:53.709 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We were told there's retail to the east of this property. 862 01:47:54.200 --> 01:48:01.600 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): There's retail available, At the shopping center that hosts the, lee Sandwich. 863 01:48:02.130 --> 01:48:06.549 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): There's retail further along to the east of the dividend Homes property that we just approved. 864 01:48:06.760 --> 01:48:08.399 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So we can go down… 865 01:48:08.810 --> 01:48:14.030 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Stevens Creek and nearly every shopping center has retail available. This isn't a question of 866 01:48:14.290 --> 01:48:17.610 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): space. This is the question of dollars for tenant improvement. 867 01:48:18.000 --> 01:48:24.210 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And perhaps that is a matter between the parcel owner terminating the lease and the tenant. 868 01:48:24.550 --> 01:48:28.220 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I don't know why the city would get in the middle of that, and where does it stop? Because… 869 01:48:28.410 --> 01:48:31.950 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Every tenant that is losing retail would face the same issue. 870 01:48:32.290 --> 01:48:37.859 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So I would… Ask us to consider encouraging the matter to be resolved. 871 01:48:37.970 --> 01:48:42.810 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Through the use of TI, dollars from the parcel owner. 872 01:48:44.090 --> 01:49:02.820 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Well, my response to that would be, and you know, I think this is something that needs to be discussed more broadly at the council level, but we do have a lot of businesses that are about to be displaced through townhome and just apartment development, and to leave them all without any support for relocation. 873 01:49:02.820 --> 01:49:05.430 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I think is going to be problematic. 874 01:49:05.435 --> 01:49:10.625 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): To the chair, the recommendation was to make a condition of approval to encourage 875 01:49:10.825 --> 01:49:13.714 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The parcel owner to consider using 876 01:49:14.035 --> 01:49:27.564 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): any dollars from early lease termination towards tenant improvement dollars for the tenant displaced. It was not that we leave them hanging, it was that we encouraged this between the two parties. The city, let me remind my 877 01:49:27.625 --> 01:49:34.735 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): colleagues here, the city is running a structural budget deficit, and we can't go from project to project waiving fees. Thank you. 878 01:49:35.090 --> 01:49:50.800 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I understand, and the applicant is providing support for the businesses to move anywhere. Now, what we are proposing is an incentive for the businesses to remain within the city, and I think that's the difference. Commissioner Fung. 879 01:49:51.310 --> 01:49:52.060 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Yeah, I… 880 01:49:53.795 --> 01:50:01.884 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): trying to come up with a budget for supporting improvements or moving costs. That's between two private 881 01:50:02.165 --> 01:50:05.934 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): two private parties. It's up to them to decide what to do there. 882 01:50:06.185 --> 01:50:13.344 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): But we are charging, you know, we are charging permit fees, we are charging these things, and I think we can make a decision. We want to keep 883 01:50:13.565 --> 01:50:16.355 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know, and I would really say uniformly. 884 01:50:16.675 --> 01:50:25.334 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): If the policy… if the policy from economic development is, hey, we're gonna give up X percent of… of our fees. 885 01:50:26.125 --> 01:50:29.075 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know, there's a clear process that's trying to make those 886 01:50:29.195 --> 01:50:31.815 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Recover, you know, to make those equal, but… 887 01:50:32.345 --> 01:50:35.374 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): That is just a decision that we need to make. 888 01:50:35.505 --> 01:50:43.995 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And I think that, you know, we have many, you know, we have many, many examples of businesses where 889 01:50:44.285 --> 01:50:53.855 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I remember I had, at the behest of a neighbor, I'd went to talk to somebody who had shortly run a shop, one of the ones in the 890 01:50:54.285 --> 01:51:01.445 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I can't remember, you know, it's where, right by, 891 01:51:02.385 --> 01:51:17.295 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): by Main Street, the other, you know, the thing in the condo building, I can't remember, 818 or whatever that thing is. Yeah, and this was one of these things where, you know, the cost of meeting the permit and inspections. 892 01:51:17.655 --> 01:51:20.394 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): you know, just made it impossible, right? So… 893 01:51:20.555 --> 01:51:28.514 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): We're not saying we're going to… we're not becoming a partner in the business, but we, you know, certainly can be an advocate for them to be here. 894 01:51:30.260 --> 01:51:47.189 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you, and what I might add to that is, you know, what we are motioning this evening is a one-off, but many cities do have formalized programs where they do support businesses in this type of instance, and we just happen to not have this formalized yet. 895 01:51:47.600 --> 01:51:49.120 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): But it's not unusual. 896 01:51:49.750 --> 01:51:57.240 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Commissioner. Through the chair, let me just remind ourselves that any waivers are fees that the rest of the residents had to pay. 897 01:51:57.350 --> 01:52:05.319 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Like Ms. Griffin sitting out here, there is no free dollars going around. When we waive fees on developers, that is borne by the rest of us. 898 01:52:05.750 --> 01:52:13.020 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And we are seeing that right now, with the city considering a tax ballot measure, the city considering utility tax increases. 899 01:52:13.530 --> 01:52:15.669 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Staff costs are not free. 900 01:52:15.870 --> 01:52:21.490 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): There's a cost of recovery, and when we hand out dollars, that really we should be encouraging 901 01:52:21.830 --> 01:52:24.300 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Those to be coming from the… 902 01:52:24.440 --> 01:52:27.640 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Parcel owner that is depriving the city of retail. 903 01:52:28.060 --> 01:52:34.779 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I think we lose ourselves the opportunity to encourage that kind of Cost of loss to be… 904 01:52:35.200 --> 01:52:41.340 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): clawed back, and I'd like to ask staff whether we have any in-lieu fees for loss of retail that we might apply here. 905 01:52:44.910 --> 01:52:49.039 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): No, there's none that I'm aware of, and you know, I think… 906 01:52:49.890 --> 01:53:00.899 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): the motion to try to capture support for the business through something tangible, that I… that I get. I think some of this we would have to look into as well, like even fee waivers, whether they're feasible or not. 907 01:53:01.010 --> 01:53:02.600 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): But… what… 908 01:53:02.940 --> 01:53:18.430 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): what I'm hearing from the Commission is this is a serious issue where you're trying to do something more than just general outreach to a business, to try to go that step further and offer what you can. So I think that… if that's what you're trying to convey to the Council when they consider this, that would make sense to include. 909 01:53:19.460 --> 01:53:33.149 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Yeah, if I can just add a quick comment on this. Yes, everything costs money, everything is a trade-off, but I think as we've heard from multiple members of the community today, this is a trade-off that many residents would be willing to make. 910 01:53:33.280 --> 01:53:38.730 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): We are getting in lieu fees as part of this project. This would… 911 01:53:38.830 --> 01:53:48.729 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): in a sense, represent a small reduction, a very, very small reduction in the grand scheme of things, of the, what, 10 million or so Lieu feed that we're getting. 912 01:53:49.880 --> 01:54:00.220 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): it's well worth it if we're able to keep these retail establishments in the city, so I think this is a trade-off that you would find a lot of residents would agree to. 913 01:54:01.270 --> 01:54:09.169 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Through the chair, question for the applicant. What is the typical tenant improvement dollars for a tenant of square footage of Voyager, if you may comment on that? 914 01:54:17.410 --> 01:54:19.410 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I think you may just be interrupt. Okay. 915 01:54:19.410 --> 01:54:20.020 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): It really. 916 01:54:20.020 --> 01:54:35.970 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): It really depends on the condition of the space. I'm not a retail expert, admittedly. We primarily focus on office space and housing, so it varies. We own another retail center, and improvements can be $20 per square foot, they can be $250 per square foot. 917 01:54:36.010 --> 01:54:43.120 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Again, it really just depends on, is it a restaurant user, what type of infrastructure is there that can be reutilized, etc. 918 01:54:44.730 --> 01:54:48.729 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is that a question staff can comment on? What sort of dollar amount are we looking at? 919 01:54:51.670 --> 01:54:57.289 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): If, the speaker's not a retail expert, I'm even less of one, so I don't. 920 01:54:57.295 --> 01:55:03.415 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I have a hard time believing the applicant claiming not to be a retail expert, having had retail in the frontage for a long time. 921 01:55:03.635 --> 01:55:08.544 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I would love to hear… Even a back of the envelope number. 922 01:55:08.545 --> 01:55:17.714 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): I really am not a retail expert. It's not my focus. It's been an accessory use of some of the office that we own. 923 01:55:17.715 --> 01:55:33.624 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): So, I just want to admit, I am not a retail expert, but if you use the, you know, upper end, and I… again, it just depends on the condition of the space, you know, let's say you use $200 per square foot, you know, it's a little bit under 2,000 square feet, let's say that puts you at, you know, close to $400,000. 924 01:55:34.075 --> 01:55:35.685 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Okay, so we're talking about… 925 01:55:35.825 --> 01:55:41.545 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): $400,000 of tenant improvement. Question for staff, what sort of permit fees would that be? 926 01:55:42.450 --> 01:55:48.779 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I don't know those off the top of my head. Tenant improvement fees are largely done through the building division as well. Okay. 927 01:55:49.650 --> 01:55:57.440 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So, can I ask you a question as well? Are Panera and Voyager paying significantly below market rent? 928 01:55:57.760 --> 01:56:04.689 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Compared to what they would have to pay in other locations in the city that… You know, we're not… 929 01:56:05.730 --> 01:56:07.919 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Give me that big COVID discount. 930 01:56:08.775 --> 01:56:25.915 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): Yes, I think Voyager is definitely paying below market rent, because of when the lease was ultimately signed. Panera is paying percentage rent, as I mentioned, because we, during COVID, just decided, hey, we'll just agree to a low occupancy cost, and so they're paying 8% of their 931 01:56:26.175 --> 01:56:33.024 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): their revenues, which is, I would say, on the low side of, you know, a retailer's occupancy costs. 932 01:56:33.030 --> 01:56:35.639 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Okay. Yeah, I mean, that's my concern, is that… 933 01:56:35.830 --> 01:56:48.050 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): even if the… even if Voyager gets the tenant improvement money from somewhere, and the impact fees are waived, wherever they go, they'll probably be paying a lot higher rent than they are now. 934 01:56:48.420 --> 01:56:52.940 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): And, you know, as we all know, restaurants are not high-margin businesses. 935 01:56:53.850 --> 01:57:09.970 Speaker 14 (Community Hall): I would agree, and I don't want to speak for Voyager either. They may have a different build-out, or, you know, again, it really just depends on the infrastructure that's in the current space. This was previously a Pete's Coffee, and they vacated during COVID, and so that, again, that can change the build-out cost, so… 936 01:57:09.975 --> 01:57:15.525 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Right. Yeah, I don't know how much of the Pete's infrastructure they kept when… when they took over. 937 01:57:15.695 --> 01:57:16.945 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Okay, thank you. 938 01:57:18.620 --> 01:57:19.460 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Commissioner Rao. 939 01:57:19.660 --> 01:57:25.789 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): through the chair, we can't go from hearing to hearing waiving $400K in fees. We just had a last hearing. 940 01:57:26.090 --> 01:57:36.930 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Where we went through a 400K fee waiver for a gate, essentially, and now we have another potential 400,000 fees or more. We can't account for the permit. 941 01:57:37.470 --> 01:57:40.950 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): aspect, so maybe there's a friendly amendment to this that 942 01:57:41.400 --> 01:57:47.710 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Limits the fee waiver to just the permit fees, and not the… Cost of tenant improvement. 943 01:57:48.055 --> 01:57:50.445 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): We're not waiving any fees here, that would… 944 01:57:50.635 --> 01:57:58.334 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): be up to either the City Council or the city staff. We're not waiving any fees here, we can't come up with an amount. So what was the. 945 01:57:58.335 --> 01:58:01.745 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The motion was to encourage… It was to encourage the… 946 01:58:03.945 --> 01:58:07.855 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Can the motion be repeated again? It was to encourage the city to do what? 947 01:58:09.050 --> 01:58:23.219 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): to basically do whatever they can to help the displaced, but we can't put a dollar amount on it, because we don't know what the city can or cannot do, so I don't know that, you know, that we can start putting dollar amounts on this. Okay. 948 01:58:23.920 --> 01:58:29.419 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): As long as it's a good faith encouragement to the city without putting a dollar amount on it, or a 949 01:58:29.790 --> 01:58:33.190 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): On a specific fee. 950 01:58:33.290 --> 01:58:35.469 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I think we sort of leave it to the… 951 01:58:37.030 --> 01:58:39.569 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): To the economic development to see what they can do. 952 01:58:40.000 --> 01:58:40.960 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Agreed. 953 01:58:41.340 --> 01:58:43.760 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): I also, I think, 954 01:58:43.870 --> 01:58:58.410 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): the chair made a good point, and I think maybe somebody else did too, but this really needs to be, an ongoing program that we do for all of our retail establishments that get, displaced, in the future. 955 01:58:59.200 --> 01:59:10.799 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): we can't be doing this piecemeal, so yeah, so we should be looking at establishing a more structured, more formal program. And that's also more fair to all the retailers. 956 01:59:11.475 --> 01:59:16.775 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I mean, I can't see the city having the money to do that. I mean, we've lost so much retail. 957 01:59:16.875 --> 01:59:20.094 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Can you imagine us… paying for… 958 01:59:20.645 --> 01:59:30.455 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): House of Falafel, and United Furniture, and I mean, it just goes on and on. I mean, we're gonna lose Marina Foods eventually, if that ever gets built. I mean… 959 01:59:30.765 --> 01:59:35.645 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Commissioner Rao has a good point. I mean, you know, the city's running a deficit. 960 01:59:35.855 --> 01:59:45.025 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): You know, and the fees are set at a level to recover costs. It's not profit for the city, so anything we don't collect comes out of the general fund. 961 01:59:46.915 --> 01:59:53.575 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So, it would be great to save Voyager. I mean, I love that place, and I would hope the city could 962 01:59:54.055 --> 01:59:55.875 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Come to some accommodation. 963 01:59:56.225 --> 02:00:01.915 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): But for a general policy for all businesses, I think it needs to be on a case-by-case basis. 964 02:00:04.750 --> 02:00:09.120 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And that would be something that's up to economic development to make that recommendation. 965 02:00:09.125 --> 02:00:12.715 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Not our… not up to us to do here. 966 02:00:12.715 --> 02:00:15.595 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Party City will be harder for them to make the… 967 02:00:15.595 --> 02:00:19.355 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I already have a tenant. Yeah. I mean, they went out of business, so… 968 02:00:19.355 --> 02:00:20.855 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Had they won… 969 02:00:20.855 --> 02:00:38.214 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): to relocate. Yeah, no, you're right. It needs to be case-by-case. We can't have something that's financially prohibitive for the city, but something to help our displaced retail, whatever, you know, whatever we can do that's financially feasible for us as a city, I think we should definitely be looking at. 970 02:00:38.855 --> 02:00:43.234 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know, you had mentioned at one point that, you know, that the, 971 02:00:44.135 --> 02:00:52.915 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): impact fees that were collected here were significant, and I don't think that was an implication that the city was trying to, you know, couldn't turn back. 972 02:00:53.065 --> 02:00:59.575 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Yeah, turn back those. I wouldn't be supportive of that, but I definitely think, you know, when… 973 02:01:01.145 --> 02:01:06.895 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I could… I could be wrong on this. We had the Starbook by the post office came for a hearing, so that they… 974 02:01:07.025 --> 02:01:14.235 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Instead of… Instead of 9AM, I think. You know, a conditional use permit modification, and I believe 975 02:01:14.745 --> 02:01:18.655 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): They asked about how much that cost, and it was quite an expensive hearing. 976 02:01:18.915 --> 02:01:22.504 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): So those are the places where I hoped that there would be an opportunity, you know? 977 02:01:22.655 --> 02:01:27.515 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): At that time, I believe that they were talking about it as $25,000 or something like that. 978 02:01:27.875 --> 02:01:33.945 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): So that… I think that that really would be the kinds of things that we would want to really say are, you know, as a city. 979 02:01:34.045 --> 02:01:37.235 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know, are we willing to forgive some part of that? 980 02:01:37.925 --> 02:01:42.585 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): To keep… to keep the businesses that are here and want to stay here in town. 981 02:01:47.890 --> 02:01:49.990 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Any further comments? 982 02:01:50.670 --> 02:01:53.330 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, then we will move to a vote. 983 02:01:53.550 --> 02:01:54.340 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Wait… 984 02:01:54.345 --> 02:02:02.775 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): No, no, can you… So, is this a vote just for the… suggestion that the city… 985 02:02:02.775 --> 02:02:09.534 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): It's a vote for approving the project as recommended by staff, plus this amendment. 986 02:02:09.535 --> 02:02:14.294 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): And if it helps, we can separate the two motions. We can move the staff recommendation. 987 02:02:14.295 --> 02:02:15.254 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): that, please. 988 02:02:16.285 --> 02:02:22.515 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I don't know there's any reason to do that. People should comment. I mean, I think people should comment on how they feel about this. 989 02:02:22.515 --> 02:02:23.065 Speaker 20 (Community Hall): Sure. 990 02:02:23.595 --> 02:02:25.584 Speaker 20 (Community Hall): Okay, yeah, I mean… 991 02:02:26.740 --> 02:02:34.569 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Unfortunately, with all the state laws, you know, we will end up with projects that don't meet our development standards. 992 02:02:34.710 --> 02:02:40.440 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): That violate the height, the setback, the… Minimum parking, the lock coverage. 993 02:02:41.090 --> 02:02:47.569 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): The maximum density, the open space, the tree removal, the landscaping, the inclusionary affordable housing. 994 02:02:47.690 --> 02:02:54.910 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): But for those of us that attended the Planning Commission Academy, as we were told, we really have no discretion anymore. These projects… 995 02:02:55.100 --> 02:02:57.930 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): You know, if you don't approve them. 996 02:02:58.280 --> 02:03:04.329 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): HCD will be contacted, you could be sued, and you will always lose. 997 02:03:04.460 --> 02:03:08.049 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So this is not… What we have discretion on. 998 02:03:08.410 --> 02:03:14.009 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I know about the concerns of… The loss of retail. 999 02:03:14.370 --> 02:03:18.340 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): The environmental issues, the affordable housing that… 1000 02:03:18.550 --> 02:03:26.479 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Those waivers, but… or concession, but we really have no choice here. I would hate to lose Voyager. 1001 02:03:26.910 --> 02:03:27.830 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Thank you. 1002 02:03:30.640 --> 02:03:39.209 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Commissioner Rao? Yeah, I had more questions. I don't think we are ready for a vote yet, unless you want to call the vote chair, but I do… I do have a question for staff. 1003 02:03:39.560 --> 02:03:45.949 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The 50 feet, does that include the rooftop deck, or is the rooftop deck above the 50 feet? 1004 02:03:47.220 --> 02:03:49.040 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): It's to the highest point of the building. 1005 02:03:49.590 --> 02:03:54.690 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Does that include the rooftop deck? Yes. The top of the rooftop deck? Yes, the highest point. 1006 02:03:56.830 --> 02:03:57.740 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Okay. 1007 02:03:58.570 --> 02:04:05.390 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And was there any means by which staff could have maintained 45 feet versus 50? My concern is we… 1008 02:04:05.610 --> 02:04:09.840 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We have a number of these projects coming at us, up and down Stevens Creek. 1009 02:04:10.180 --> 02:04:14.979 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Up until now, I don't think we've approved 50 feet. Staff can correct me if I'm wrong. 1010 02:04:15.320 --> 02:04:17.930 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Have you approved 50 feet on any other projects so far? 1011 02:04:19.440 --> 02:04:23.110 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Well, I think you had mentioned Westport earlier, which was over 70. 1012 02:04:23.115 --> 02:04:23.545 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): which is, 1013 02:04:23.635 --> 02:04:24.655 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): different… 1014 02:04:24.660 --> 02:04:26.160 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Different entity, yes. 1015 02:04:26.160 --> 02:04:26.990 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): 48. 1016 02:04:27.260 --> 02:04:31.780 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Townhomes, they're typically running 40 or more, some in the high 30s. Right. 1017 02:04:31.785 --> 02:04:37.285 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So my concern here is that 40 feet, we are already 10 feet over what the general plan 1018 02:04:37.505 --> 02:04:43.774 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): recommends for R3, or requires for R3. Here we have single-family units at 50 feet. 1019 02:04:43.905 --> 02:04:46.845 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The next project that comes along asks for 60 feet, and… 1020 02:04:47.535 --> 02:04:54.574 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): If I understand stuff right, we have no ability to deny that, and they could go 60 and 70, and at what point can we deny these? 1021 02:04:55.590 --> 02:05:11.470 Speaker 7 (Community Hall): So to clarify, the standard for residential and heart of the City is 45 feet, and then, no, we do not… again, it's the same findings for significant buildings, public health, and safety. Those are the… that's the only criteria for which we can deny the waiver. 1022 02:05:11.645 --> 02:05:14.684 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): again, at what height can we deny these? I think that's. 1023 02:05:14.685 --> 02:05:23.225 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Unknown. I don't know. You… you would have to be able to tie that back to some health and safety concern, something specific. 1024 02:05:24.060 --> 02:05:26.500 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And is that something that staff… 1025 02:05:28.640 --> 02:05:36.830 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): has a position on in terms of, I mean, is this just… so the next project that we hear, let's say Bandley Drive is going to be 60 feet? 1026 02:05:37.680 --> 02:05:39.599 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And we'd have to approve that. 1027 02:05:41.770 --> 02:05:49.350 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Again, I'm not going to speculate on what we might get. We look at each project as it comes, but again, I think it's been articulated here. 1028 02:05:49.680 --> 02:05:51.709 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Under density bonus law. 1029 02:05:51.820 --> 02:06:01.780 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): We have obligations to look at the project as designed, and unless you have specific reasons where you can cite a specific health and safety impact. 1030 02:06:02.500 --> 02:06:06.909 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): There's really not a lot you can do. The burden is on the city to make that finding. 1031 02:06:09.060 --> 02:06:14.380 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And I'd like to invite the applicant up to the podium if the applicant has any… 1032 02:06:14.630 --> 02:06:22.140 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): thoughts on whether the 45 feet versus 50 feet is required financially to make the project feasible. I believe the law requires 1033 02:06:22.750 --> 02:06:24.639 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Clarification on that? 1034 02:06:25.645 --> 02:06:35.835 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): the… there's no need for financial feasibility for a waiver under state density bonus law. It's only for concessions, it needs to be a cost savings, and that is not one of our concessions. 1035 02:06:35.985 --> 02:06:36.705 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): Okay. 1036 02:06:40.955 --> 02:06:45.464 Speaker 19 (Community Hall): And just, I assume it'll be coming up. I don't believe there's a second, just in case that's not lost. 1037 02:06:47.930 --> 02:06:50.220 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Oh, I think there was a second to the motion. 1038 02:06:50.350 --> 02:06:57.410 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I did have a… yes. I did have a clarifying question for staff. So, you know, with this motion that is on the table. 1039 02:06:58.120 --> 02:07:08.370 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): the next step would just be that staff would take it back and study options, and would those options be presented anywhere to Council, or would they just be worked out? 1040 02:07:08.935 --> 02:07:13.194 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): In terms of options for the financial feasibility? Or, or just… okay. 1041 02:07:13.200 --> 02:07:24.420 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): options in terms of helping the business relocate. Whatever comes out of that exploration, what would happen with that? 1042 02:07:25.620 --> 02:07:42.159 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): That's a good question. I think we could report out what is feasible. I mean, I think some things, like fee waivers, are a direct request. Can you do it or not? But I think all… some of the discussions sort of went on to, like, policies in terms of all businesses, some businesses, where do you draw the line? 1043 02:07:43.520 --> 02:07:51.749 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I would think it's open to discussion that the city will be having, because this is already… preservation of retail is already something 1044 02:07:51.980 --> 02:07:54.909 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): It's getting looked at through the work program, and is… 1045 02:07:55.110 --> 02:07:59.299 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): generating comments at most public meetings these days. 1046 02:07:59.510 --> 02:08:01.180 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): But I think in terms of… 1047 02:08:02.120 --> 02:08:12.989 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): specific assistance for this project, we could look at what is feasible of the things that have been mentioned. So that would be, you know, communicating with our economic development staff and others to see 1048 02:08:13.150 --> 02:08:15.289 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): What… what would even be possible? 1049 02:08:16.440 --> 02:08:20.359 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Great, thank you very much. And would that get reported back to us, or to the Council? 1050 02:08:20.585 --> 02:08:30.504 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): It would definitely be what we could between now and the council meeting in two weeks. Okay. And I would be happy to follow up, too, with this body to just say what we found based on this discussion. That would be great. 1051 02:08:30.505 --> 02:08:31.845 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Thank you. Yeah. 1052 02:08:31.845 --> 02:08:39.115 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): without making any change to the motion that's on the table, I would just say that because this is on an expedited schedule. 1053 02:08:39.595 --> 02:08:40.604 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I think that… 1054 02:08:41.555 --> 02:08:47.874 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Certainly from my side, I would say we would recommend that this be something that you prepare for part of the, Council. 1055 02:08:48.005 --> 02:08:54.025 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): presentation, you know, that would include, you know, if it's impossible to include outreach to the, you know, Panera and to… 1056 02:08:55.005 --> 02:08:58.735 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know, to both guys here. 1057 02:08:59.305 --> 02:09:02.205 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Correct, and obviously we have time because the… 1058 02:09:02.475 --> 02:09:06.415 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Approval and relocation could happen some distance apart as well. 1059 02:09:08.530 --> 02:09:22.560 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Question for staff, does staff go through the heart of the city-specific plan to ensure that every objective… 1060 02:09:23.020 --> 02:09:27.139 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): standard within the Heart of the City specific plan. 1061 02:09:27.440 --> 02:09:31.840 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is either waived by the applicant or is adhered to. 1062 02:09:32.890 --> 02:09:36.769 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): We look at the heart of the city, some of it is objective, some of it is not. 1063 02:09:37.710 --> 02:09:43.040 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): To the extent that specific standards are quantified and therefore objective. 1064 02:09:43.430 --> 02:09:47.890 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Is the expectation that either the applicant adheres to that, or it is waived? 1065 02:09:49.460 --> 02:09:55.630 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Especially where they're referenced in the general plan, yes. If there is an objective, measurable standard, yes. 1066 02:09:55.870 --> 02:10:01.030 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And if the applicant has not explicitly sought a waiver of something that is deemed objective. 1067 02:10:01.460 --> 02:10:07.000 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Would that be basis for finding that the project is not in compliance with the heart of the City-specific plan? 1068 02:10:07.850 --> 02:10:11.519 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Oh, the one thing to keep in mind is there's an unlimited number of waivers. 1069 02:10:11.960 --> 02:10:15.629 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Sure, but we can only comment on the waivers that are in the agenda packet. 1070 02:10:16.270 --> 02:10:17.000 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): True. 1071 02:10:17.560 --> 02:10:21.260 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): The applicant may then choose to come back with a different application. 1072 02:10:21.260 --> 02:10:33.850 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): I'm sorry, if I can interrupt, this sounds like you're trying to learn how to do your job, and this doesn't sound relevant to the agenda item right now. If you're trying to figure out how to be a planning commissioner, I would… 1073 02:10:33.855 --> 02:10:38.254 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, the comment is not appropriate. The commissioner was not recognized through the chair. 1074 02:10:39.010 --> 02:10:44.080 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, I'd just like to ask that we all be respectful. Do you have any final questions? 1075 02:10:44.180 --> 02:10:45.330 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): for staff. 1076 02:10:45.525 --> 02:10:46.094 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): I do. 1077 02:10:46.135 --> 02:10:54.874 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I don't think the comment was complete yet. So, under what basis would this project be viewed non-compliant with the Heart of the City-specific plan? 1078 02:10:56.750 --> 02:11:02.370 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I would need something more specific than that. I don't know if there's something you have specifically in mind. 1079 02:11:02.375 --> 02:11:07.364 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So specifically, if there are objective standards in the Heart of the City-specific plan. 1080 02:11:07.575 --> 02:11:10.034 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That were not explicitly sought as a waiver. 1081 02:11:10.385 --> 02:11:15.485 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Would that be basis for… Finding the project not compliant with the heart of the City-specific plan. 1082 02:11:16.580 --> 02:11:20.260 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): I'm not aware of anything it's not compliant with. Okay. 1083 02:11:20.265 --> 02:11:27.204 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): staff's opinion, this… Has been assessed to see everything that is objective has either been accepted or waived. 1084 02:11:27.585 --> 02:11:29.714 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, that is correct, yes. Okay. 1085 02:11:30.780 --> 02:11:31.370 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Thank you. 1086 02:11:32.210 --> 02:11:45.739 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. I just wanted to briefly comment. First of all, thank you to the applicant. I know that you have put a lot of thought into this, and you did want to make the retail work, and that was a challenge. I also want to thank the community for 1087 02:11:45.780 --> 02:11:56.739 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): you know, coming out and making your money comments. We hear you on, especially on the business front, and, you know, we hope that there are ways that we can assist in the relocation. 1088 02:11:57.250 --> 02:12:15.609 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): If that happens. But, you know, in general, I do think that this is a good location for housing, and it should be actually very supportive to the businesses around it that do remain. You know, again, hopefully we can find a home for Voyager and Panera. 1089 02:12:15.800 --> 02:12:18.770 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Those are my comments. Any other comments from the Commission? Yeah, yeah. 1090 02:12:18.775 --> 02:12:20.025 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): A couple comments as well. 1091 02:12:20.205 --> 02:12:35.645 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): One of them, one of them I've made in other hearings as well, you did, you did comment on the financial benefit of this project to the city. I would encourage you to reach out to FUHSD and CUSD, the school districts, and, you know. 1092 02:12:35.765 --> 02:12:43.204 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Cupertino values the school districts highly here, and having a report on that, the impact of 1093 02:12:43.515 --> 02:12:52.545 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): of new home development, you know, with Prop 13, the impact is significant and appreciated without you, you know, making any… trying to cut any kind of deal. 1094 02:12:52.735 --> 02:12:55.064 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): But if there's an opportunity to find a synergy. 1095 02:12:55.565 --> 02:13:02.924 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): to find a synergy or something that makes these things work better, you know, I think it would really be great. I know they're very open to having that discussion. 1096 02:13:04.805 --> 02:13:11.904 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Number two item… I… I'm surprised nobody commented on this. I thought that the arborist report was really notable. It was very interesting. 1097 02:13:12.115 --> 02:13:20.145 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Often it is not. So this one was, you know, one of the things that I saw in the report was that I… 1098 02:13:20.425 --> 02:13:32.945 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): initially was surprised, given the number of trees that were going to be removed. That's part of building things, and it was even clear in the staff report that there were issues about, you know, the site is somewhat overgrown because of the history. 1099 02:13:33.125 --> 02:13:39.295 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): But I thought it was very clear in the arborist report that it was kind of, a lot of the… 1100 02:13:39.435 --> 02:13:45.794 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): where it is at today was detrimental, and I think it was very supportive of the… of the kind of plan. 1101 02:13:45.965 --> 02:13:53.915 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): a number of things that were embodied in the plan you had. So, one of the things I would, again, I just, as a comment, perhaps as a comment to staff. 1102 02:13:54.075 --> 02:13:56.295 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): That… 1103 02:13:59.245 --> 02:14:13.845 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): the number, you know, when it's expressed as a ratio, expressed as a count on a table, that's something I think that we want to embody good practice in the way that we do things, you know, in every element of what we do, which includes the landscape plan. 1104 02:14:13.875 --> 02:14:20.364 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And that, you know, the arborist actually was pretty… I'm surprised they're just pretty outspoken compared to what I've normally seen here, that… 1105 02:14:20.415 --> 02:14:36.565 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): That, well, you know, you don't want to have a wonderful one replanting here. One of the ones that was particular… in light of some of the comments we've had here today, one of the things that was happening was that you were preserving a number of pear trees that I think the arborists just didn't like at all. 1106 02:14:38.155 --> 02:14:52.064 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): So I would… I would actually say that this is an example of a place where, you know, maybe there's an opportunity to be forward-thinking and to kind of honor the intent of the heart of the city without necessarily sticking with a tree that might not have been a good choice. 1107 02:14:52.295 --> 02:15:03.294 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Now, again, given the comments we've had here today, you probably shouldn't touch those trees, but, you know, I would just consider that. This is something where, you know. 1108 02:15:03.385 --> 02:15:13.085 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): At Apple Park, it's quite notable. There are a lot of stories about, you know, the way that the planting was done there. It's very forward-thinking. 1109 02:15:13.245 --> 02:15:17.715 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And there's an opportunity here to, to do that in this site as well. 1110 02:15:18.055 --> 02:15:24.825 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): Let's see… we… we had commented at the very outset about net laws. 1111 02:15:25.235 --> 02:15:28.874 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And that was actually one of the big concerns, you know. Again. 1112 02:15:28.925 --> 02:15:45.244 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): The report is absolutely correct in that the number of units produced is… puts us at a much larger deficit, particularly in, you know, the very low-income area rate, because these are for sale, and they're going to be very expensive. 1113 02:15:45.635 --> 02:15:48.175 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): expensive units. 1114 02:15:48.555 --> 02:16:01.195 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I do think that it is notable that much of this site was not intended, as they were not designated housing element areas, and that that does mean that for the area… for the other, you know, three parcels. 1115 02:16:01.195 --> 02:16:09.114 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): There's a significant number of more homes being presented there, and I hope that, I would encourage you, again, in preparation for the City Council meeting. 1116 02:16:09.125 --> 02:16:10.075 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): that you… 1117 02:16:10.235 --> 02:16:29.894 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): take the most favorable, positive way, you know, reasonable interpretation of that, so that people coming into that can understand, you know, this is a plus. Overall, it is a plus. You know, we're coming out… we're coming out way ahead here, as opposed to being way, way, way behind. You know, you see that number, the negative… 1118 02:16:29.985 --> 02:16:47.435 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): 250 or something, and it, you know, that kind of speaks to that there is a problem, and we've spoken about it as a group, that the nature of the projects that are coming forward, you know, with townhomes in particular, are causing, you know, causing significantly lower density, right? 1119 02:16:47.545 --> 02:16:49.025 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): But… 1120 02:16:49.195 --> 02:17:04.574 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): these are the projects that can get built today. That makes them, you know, that brings value here. And, you know, and I think that these will be healthy things for the city. You know, we have fewer of the… fewer of the issues about the, you know, 80-foot-tall building. 1121 02:17:05.065 --> 02:17:10.764 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): I also do also want to comment, that I did also think it was notable, 1122 02:17:11.014 --> 02:17:15.654 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): this project's team, development team, was unusually tied to, Cupertino. 1123 02:17:15.895 --> 02:17:30.894 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): You know, there's, having, people who are long-time residents and who grew up here, so, you know, I think… I think that's good. That actually showed to me in terms of the consideration for how this is going to interface with the city. You know, it's not… 1124 02:17:31.075 --> 02:17:37.094 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): This is not a math problem to solve. This is, you know, this is a place that, you know, that you are a part of. 1125 02:17:37.325 --> 02:17:42.085 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): So I, I think that that, you know, that, that is, meaningful as well. 1126 02:17:42.455 --> 02:17:54.424 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): That particular site, I worked at Apple for 13 years, starting at the very beginning of my career. The amount of positive mojo that is in that site is, kind of out of this world. 1127 02:17:54.545 --> 02:18:01.194 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): The number of things that changed people's lives that were developed in those buildings. Pretty darn incredible. 1128 02:18:01.424 --> 02:18:05.594 Speaker 4 (Community Hall): And I believe that is it for my comments. Thank you very much. 1129 02:18:08.030 --> 02:18:10.940 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you, Commissioner Fung. Do we have any other… Commissioner Lenskog? 1130 02:18:11.219 --> 02:18:19.389 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): Yeah, just have a quick comment. I do want to commend the developer. I know you guys have worked really hard at trying to come up with an attractive, 1131 02:18:19.619 --> 02:18:26.829 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): well-thought-through development, and it shows. You know, it's like pages after pages of really thoughtful details, and 1132 02:18:26.999 --> 02:18:35.659 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): I know the retail is a tough one, and I know you guys tried, so thank you for that. I mean, I know we've gone back and forth on it quite a bit. 1133 02:18:35.659 --> 02:18:47.739 Speaker 9 (Community Hall): But I do want to commend you guys for the effort you've put into thinking through all the details and trying to make this development as the best it can be, and I think it's going to be a real asset to the community, so thank you. 1134 02:18:49.840 --> 02:18:51.400 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. Any other comments? 1135 02:18:52.040 --> 02:18:53.419 Speaker 20 (Community Hall): Vice Chair. Vice Chair? 1136 02:18:54.299 --> 02:18:57.479 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Nope. I, I, yeah. Yes, Commissioner Rao? 1137 02:18:57.799 --> 02:19:00.999 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I can go next. Yes, he said he did not have a comment. 1138 02:19:01.410 --> 02:19:04.400 Speaker 18 (Community Hall): Do you want me to go next, or… Commissioner Ralph, yes. 1139 02:19:04.540 --> 02:19:20.090 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Yeah, so I'd like to firstly congratulate the applicant. I think this is a good project. I think it adds housing to the community in an area that is not surrounded by single-family homes, and therefore is least disruptive to the neighborhood in terms of single- family homes. I think this is a… 1140 02:19:20.250 --> 02:19:29.669 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): good addition to the businesses that are surrounding your property. The YMCA will appreciate, hopefully, new memberships that will come from your development. 1141 02:19:29.790 --> 02:19:37.239 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Happy Days. We'll probably look forward to young toddlers coming in at walking distance from this property. I think the… 1142 02:19:37.469 --> 02:19:49.130 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): project is styled attractively. Architecturally. I think these are well-designed projects. I want to congratulate Kevin and the team on the work that's gone into this, so I think this is a good, stylish addition to the 1143 02:19:49.270 --> 02:19:53.140 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Stevens Creek stretch that we're seeing a number of projects coming up. 1144 02:19:53.480 --> 02:20:03.450 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I do appreciate the community recreational area that you're gonna have. That is something that not all projects have, and you've been thoughtful to provide that, so it certainly speaks to your 1145 02:20:03.450 --> 02:20:19.859 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): long-term ownership of the site. I know your family has been involved with the site for 45 years, and that kind of long-term ownership is very rare in commercial real estate. It's often transactional, it's sold every 5 years, every 10 years, and so holding and operating a site for 45 years is very, very rare, so I want to 1146 02:20:19.920 --> 02:20:26.690 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I want to thank you for having that sort of skin in the game in the community. I think that's really appreciated, and the fact that you're… 1147 02:20:27.020 --> 02:20:32.840 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Turning it into thoughtful development shows that you've… You've really appreciated what 1148 02:20:32.940 --> 02:20:37.709 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That property has been to you as a property for your family, and so… 1149 02:20:37.810 --> 02:20:46.040 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Certainly, we appreciate all of that. I also appreciate the art that you are going to maintain on the property. Again, we don't see that many times. 1150 02:20:46.320 --> 02:20:49.329 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): developers used to do the art in Luffy's. 1151 02:20:50.150 --> 02:21:07.689 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And so that's, that's going to be a net positive addition. So overall, I think we have a win-win here in terms of adding new units, architecturally appealing units, adding units where there is no disruption to the neighborhood, that brings in business to Target, to happy days and everything else. 1152 02:21:07.750 --> 02:21:24.010 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): There are a few things I would encourage you to consider. We've talked about more trees in the off-site area, which is the street frontage. If you might work with the public works to see if you can accommodate a few more trees, I think that'll make your property more appealing to your buyers, because ultimately. 1153 02:21:24.170 --> 02:21:28.169 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): you are competing with a lot of development happening up and down Stevens Creek, and… 1154 02:21:28.300 --> 02:21:33.810 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I will say that this is an architecturally superior product to much of what we have seen so far, so that there is that. 1155 02:21:34.250 --> 02:21:38.140 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I will also encourage you to think about, you know, 50 feet. 1156 02:21:38.640 --> 02:21:53.700 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): You have a community that is immigrant-rich, and a community that tends to bring in aging parents, aging in-laws, young kids, and you want to really think about, if not for this one, maybe your next project, whether 50 feet, is really the kind of home 1157 02:21:53.870 --> 02:22:05.709 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): that suits your buyer. You're building at 3,600 square feet down to about 2,300 square feet. When you're at 2,600 to 3,600 square feet, those are not starter homes, typically. Those are homes that you're going to price up. 1158 02:22:05.720 --> 02:22:16.030 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): In the range, those are homes that people live in for a long term. They lock in their tax bases, they stay at that tax basis, and so climbing up and down 50 feet is not trivial, and so I'd encourage you to 1159 02:22:16.170 --> 02:22:20.910 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): really think about the persona you're building for. Is it the starter home persona? Is it the… 1160 02:22:21.370 --> 02:22:27.380 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the buyer that can afford a $3,600 home and wants to nest in that home for the long term. So those are some things to consider. 1161 02:22:27.580 --> 02:22:31.099 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): In terms of retail, I would encourage you to work with the tenant. 1162 02:22:31.240 --> 02:22:41.910 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Maintaining goodwill always works well, so anything you can do to feed some lease termination fees into the tenant, I know we've got a commission that 1163 02:22:42.020 --> 02:22:50.870 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): would like a broader, motion that encourages the city to do things, but as you know, the city is running a deficit, and so I'd encourage you to 1164 02:22:50.990 --> 02:23:00.380 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): In good faith, see what you can do to help the tenant out, especially in, turning some of these shelves that we have sitting vacant into, into dollars. 1165 02:23:00.480 --> 02:23:07.519 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That you can help them out with. And then finally, I will also add, for your benefit, you know, every project that's come here. 1166 02:23:07.690 --> 02:23:11.400 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): there has been some negotiation, some give and take. We've had… 1167 02:23:11.560 --> 02:23:25.940 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): One developer that literally gave up a third floor, not asking you to do that, but literally gave up a third floor because the single-family neighborhood came in here, and in the hearing, we did actually have that change. We had another developer work with staff ahead of time. 1168 02:23:26.180 --> 02:23:27.100 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): 2… 1169 02:23:27.360 --> 02:23:41.770 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): change some of the tree layouts, change some of the setbacks on another property that overlooked single-family homes. We do not have those circumstances here, but we do have retail. And so I'd encourage you, just in the spirit of community, to see how we can help the retail out. 1170 02:23:41.930 --> 02:23:43.199 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That's all I have, thank you. 1171 02:23:45.230 --> 02:23:47.489 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you. Any other comments from the Commission? 1172 02:23:47.740 --> 02:23:50.909 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Do we have any other comments on the motion at hand before voting? 1173 02:23:51.850 --> 02:23:56.050 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, if not, we will… City Clerk, will you please have the vote? 1174 02:24:07.100 --> 02:24:08.860 Speaker 2 (Community Hall): The motion carries unanimously. 1175 02:24:11.430 --> 02:24:15.079 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you very much. Then we will move on to… 1176 02:24:15.320 --> 02:24:20.740 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Old business, none, new business, we also have none. Do we have any staff and commission reports? 1177 02:24:22.160 --> 02:24:39.059 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): The only thing I can think of, and I'm probably blanking on some upcoming projects, because I know they're out there, but, as you know, we're dealing with the no net loss situation. We're planning to take a contract to get our housing element consultant, Place Works, on board on April 7. 1178 02:24:39.620 --> 02:24:51.209 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): So, hoping one of the meetings in April that we may have a discussion here prior to the consultant being involved. I don't think they'll be able to make that meeting, because they should have just gotten on board. 1179 02:24:51.460 --> 02:25:01.950 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): But, to maybe have a discussion on a very general sense, to be looking at available or potential housing sites, that we can start getting something so… 1180 02:25:02.430 --> 02:25:12.340 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): we get that discussion initiated ahead of our consultant coming. We obviously already have ideas, which we discussed at the March 3rd City Council meeting, but… 1181 02:25:12.670 --> 02:25:23.399 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): given that time is really of the essence on that, I think that would be a good forum to have for this commission. So, I'm not sure if it'd be first or second meeting, but I'd like to get it in April. 1182 02:25:24.980 --> 02:25:36.609 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Excellent. Thank you so much, Assistant Director Connolly. It's good to have the heads up in advance so we can, you know, start thinking about potential housing sites that we may want to bring forth. So, thank you. Do we have any other Commission reports? 1183 02:25:37.560 --> 02:25:39.780 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Commissioner Scharf? Oh, sorry, Vice Chair. 1184 02:25:40.280 --> 02:25:46.419 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): It doesn't matter. Yeah, I just wanted to give a short report on the Planning Commissioner Academy that 1185 02:25:46.590 --> 02:25:53.519 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I attended in Anaheim, The chair, and… Commissioner Rao also attended. 1186 02:25:53.630 --> 02:26:00.470 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So… I don't know how to say this so it doesn't sound wrong, but… 1187 02:26:00.770 --> 02:26:03.710 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): we're really fortunate in Cupertino to have a… 1188 02:26:03.830 --> 02:26:12.200 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): planning commission that really understands all these housing issues. And talking to some of the other 1189 02:26:12.400 --> 02:26:15.389 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Commissioners from cities, that is not always the case. 1190 02:26:15.590 --> 02:26:18.990 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): And I would say, in nearly every session we went to. 1191 02:26:20.150 --> 02:26:34.380 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): when it was time for questions, I was up there, the chair was up there, Santosh was up there, and we all had really good questions, because we have the experience. We're one of the first cities that faced AB130 projects, 1192 02:26:34.510 --> 02:26:39.840 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): We also… As I mentioned, we're the poster child for SB35 projects. 1193 02:26:40.020 --> 02:26:40.930 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Bam. 1194 02:26:41.160 --> 02:26:50.449 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): SB35 has been modified multiple times, including one modification that was done just for one city, Cupertino. 1195 02:26:51.200 --> 02:26:58.409 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I would say some of the speaker things to take away, one speaker really urged us 1196 02:26:58.570 --> 02:27:04.909 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): urge cities to have legislative review committees, because there are so many state laws on housing. 1197 02:27:05.250 --> 02:27:19.729 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): there were… the last day, Cal Cities presented a list of the upcoming housing laws going through the legislature. There's 46 new housing laws going through. Some of them are trying to clean up older laws, some are new laws. 1198 02:27:19.880 --> 02:27:31.450 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Some are harmless, some are very harmful, so it's very urgent that we stay on top of this. So I'm so glad our city council reestablished the Legislative Review Committee after 1199 02:27:31.570 --> 02:27:36.050 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Previous city council, unfortunately, had gotten rid of it. 1200 02:27:36.220 --> 02:27:50.949 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Another speaker urged cities to keep their impact and in-lieu fees up to date, continue to do nexus studies, because most cities are falling behind on what those in-lieu fees should actually be, and the impact fees. 1201 02:27:51.090 --> 02:27:54.800 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Yeah, the last day, the Cal Cities. 1202 02:27:54.910 --> 02:28:05.380 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): advocate went… legislative advocate went through all those housing bills very fast. Too fast, in my opinion. That should have been a 2-hour session, not a 30-minute session. 1203 02:28:07.460 --> 02:28:12.279 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): I do have a list of all 46 laws, but I'm not going to go through them right now. 1204 02:28:12.440 --> 02:28:13.860 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So, thank you. 1205 02:28:15.400 --> 02:28:18.030 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you very much, Vice Chair, Commissioner Rao? 1206 02:28:18.860 --> 02:28:27.109 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Thank you. I would echo what the, what the Vice Chair said. I think it was really good to have the opportunity to 1207 02:28:27.510 --> 02:28:33.289 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): to get to know peer commissioners and staff from other cities, I think this is, 1208 02:28:33.460 --> 02:28:40.360 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Actually, something that even locally, maybe there are opportunities for us to pursue in a low-cost way. Maybe there are future agenda items that 1209 02:28:40.600 --> 02:28:43.299 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Allow us to do a study session with other 1210 02:28:43.880 --> 02:28:58.099 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): planning departments that we might invite, or they might invite, so we should explore low-cost ways of having local chapters. I think one point that I will add to the conversation is it is a study… it's a tale of two cities. You had 1211 02:28:58.270 --> 02:29:05.799 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): a number of small towns that had very little in common with the kinds of issues that we have. And then we had a number of these 1212 02:29:06.010 --> 02:29:13.830 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): larger population cities, you know, Walnut Creek, Dublin, San Ramon, Palo Alto, Sunnyvale, we could go down the list. 1213 02:29:13.990 --> 02:29:26.629 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): and the equivalent in Southern California that really share the same set of challenges. And so, to the extent that several of those are in this area, I would encourage staff and chair to look at future agenda setting as an opportunity to 1214 02:29:26.720 --> 02:29:43.909 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): just invite some of those people in in ways that don't cost us anything, and maybe they will reciprocate, and we will get to attend theirs, because I think there's a lot to be learned in sharing how staff approach these projects, how commissioners approach these projects, and what are some creative ways we may use to really 1215 02:29:44.190 --> 02:29:49.929 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Work within the bounds of the state laws, but still find ways to advance the community's needs. 1216 02:29:50.050 --> 02:30:02.039 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): A couple of specific things that came out. I had questions about AB130, and it was clear there was a lot of academic knowledge, but nobody had seen the project so far. I understand Mountain View has a project. 1217 02:30:02.670 --> 02:30:05.290 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I think it's Mountain View, or maybe it's Palo Alto. 1218 02:30:05.450 --> 02:30:08.959 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): But, that did not come up from the Mountaine Commissioners who were there. 1219 02:30:09.180 --> 02:30:18.499 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): So to the extent that we can, I think we should refine our AB130 understanding and even advance that through sessions that staff may offer. 1220 02:30:18.640 --> 02:30:24.220 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I think given the, as the Vice Chair said, given the amount of knowledge the city has, I would like to see us 1221 02:30:24.820 --> 02:30:38.400 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): put forth more speaking sessions at CalCities. Maybe staff can do speaking sessions, even if it's not the annual meeting, maybe there's virtual meetings where staff can do speaking sessions, commissioners can do speaking sessions, maybe we can do joint speaking sessions, so I think 1222 02:30:38.610 --> 02:30:42.710 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Clearly, either our city is outspoken, or thoughtful, or both. 1223 02:30:43.240 --> 02:30:49.839 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We're able to… they're able to advance things that I think we did not see from the other commissioners. 1224 02:30:49.980 --> 02:30:53.870 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): It was also striking to me how many of the commissioners in that room 1225 02:30:54.060 --> 02:30:57.630 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): We're actually in the profession directly, either as a developer. 1226 02:30:57.780 --> 02:31:02.430 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): As an employee of a developer, as a public works civil engineer. 1227 02:31:02.610 --> 02:31:06.940 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): As an architect, and so it was incredible to see how 1228 02:31:07.050 --> 02:31:08.900 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Few of them were actually just 1229 02:31:09.290 --> 02:31:12.749 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Members of the community at large that were able to offer 1230 02:31:12.950 --> 02:31:19.659 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): thoughtful input without necessarily being in the profession themselves. It also begs the question of how do you separate the 1231 02:31:19.800 --> 02:31:20.810 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the, 1232 02:31:21.210 --> 02:31:27.669 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): the professional side of wanting to approve certain things versus the community side of it, so it certainly begs that question. 1233 02:31:27.860 --> 02:31:33.669 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): That's all I have. I think it's a great opportunity to see how we can locally recreate some of that. Thank you. 1234 02:31:35.200 --> 02:31:45.420 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Thank you very much, and I also have a commission report on this topic, but I submitted it for the written communications, and so it will be covered in April. 1235 02:31:45.530 --> 02:31:51.109 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): With that, do we have any future agenda- setting items? I do. Okay. 1236 02:31:51.860 --> 02:31:57.860 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): So, I don't know if this is legal, or if we did it, there would suddenly be another state law to prohibit it. 1237 02:31:59.590 --> 02:32:04.599 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): How about an impact fee that we add to help displaced retail? 1238 02:32:05.430 --> 02:32:09.990 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Does our attorney have any… 1239 02:32:10.330 --> 02:32:16.650 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): Opinion on there's any state law that would eliminate… that would prohibit such an impact fee? 1240 02:32:18.360 --> 02:32:24.919 Speaker 8 (Community Hall): I'm not aware of any as I sit here, Commissioner, but do you have a second? We certainly would add that to the future agenda. Second. Okay. 1241 02:32:24.920 --> 02:32:27.510 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): And then, the other one, 1242 02:32:28.440 --> 02:32:35.270 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): we've been lucky in Cupertino so far that all these projects have, included… 1243 02:32:35.630 --> 02:32:39.259 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): BMR units, whether inclusionary or non- inclusionary. 1244 02:32:39.620 --> 02:32:42.220 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): But it is possible that in the future. 1245 02:32:42.370 --> 02:32:45.280 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): A developer will say, hey, 1246 02:32:45.470 --> 02:32:52.970 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): You know, I want to pay an inlufi instead of including the BMR. So we really need to have a nexus study 1247 02:32:53.090 --> 02:32:57.370 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): that would… determine what that in-loo fee would be, because… 1248 02:32:58.240 --> 02:33:03.090 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): It costs a tremendous amount of money for the land and the construction costs. 1249 02:33:03.220 --> 02:33:11.739 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): for these BMR units. I mean, they could easily cost a million dollars each to build. So I think we really need to start looking at, 1250 02:33:12.610 --> 02:33:22.019 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): figuring out what those in-lieu fees should be. So, that would be another agenda item. Maybe that's more of a council agenda item than a planning commission. 1251 02:33:22.390 --> 02:33:25.849 Speaker 12 (Community Hall): agenda item, or is it both? I don't know. 1252 02:33:26.395 --> 02:33:32.154 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I thought that was on the City Work program, am I wrong? There's a Nexus fee study? 1253 02:33:32.990 --> 02:33:38.140 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): There is a nexus fee study, I think it may be more broad, though, than… 1254 02:33:38.340 --> 02:33:40.919 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): what Commissioner Scharf is referring to, which… 1255 02:33:41.800 --> 02:33:45.929 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): Is a real issue, in my view, if you start having people wave 1256 02:33:46.360 --> 02:33:54.369 Speaker 6 (Community Hall): BMR fees. Our current fee is only designed to capture fractional units and would not possibly pay for the construction of BMR units. 1257 02:33:56.910 --> 02:33:58.109 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I will second that. 1258 02:34:00.200 --> 02:34:05.499 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And… Through the chair, I did have a suggested future agenda item, a couple of them. 1259 02:34:05.690 --> 02:34:16.589 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I'd like to suggest an agenda item for a study session on the fire evacuation study. I believe the consultant that wrote the report was not at the hearing. It would be good to have a detailed study session 1260 02:34:16.880 --> 02:34:24.040 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): on the recommendations from that fire evacuation study, and maybe suggestions that the Commission may have for 1261 02:34:24.420 --> 02:34:28.190 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Amendments to that fire evacuation study and see if that may even 1262 02:34:28.510 --> 02:34:32.200 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): make its way to Council, so I want to suggest that. Do I have a second? 1263 02:34:34.360 --> 02:34:35.259 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): I'll second that. 1264 02:34:37.130 --> 02:34:44.930 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): And then just as a consideration for the chair and staff for future hearings that involve AB130, it would be good to have fire. 1265 02:34:45.040 --> 02:34:51.359 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): Not only present in the room, but also consider including in the written record any fire review. 1266 02:34:51.470 --> 02:34:54.879 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): For fire mitigation, since that is the basis for 1267 02:34:55.790 --> 02:35:01.670 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): for exempting the AB130 waiver in certain fire hazard severity zones. 1268 02:35:01.820 --> 02:35:04.520 Speaker 5 (Community Hall): I hope we can include that in future hearings that are coming up. 1269 02:35:05.900 --> 02:35:08.769 Speaker 3 (Community Hall): Okay, thank you very much, and with that, we'll adjourn the meeting. 1270 02:35:14.140 --> 02:35:14.660 Community Hall: Yeah.